[fdpaq0580]

Originally Posted by golfing eagles

True, but they don't need 7 billion of us.

Read the Georgia Guidestones---the first rule is "reduce the world's population to 500 million".
Who erected those megaliths? Nobody knows---possibly the freemasons, possibly the Bilderberg group or maybe just some eccentric millionaire. The reality is that there are those, usually old money, that actually resent the rest of us for "eating their food, drinking their water and breathing their air"

Welcome to this side if the fence. Over population has always been the underlying cause for most of humankind's problems. Getting couple to willingly limit themselves to two offspring will be tough, if not impossible. China tried limiting the number of children a family could have. The result, due to the societal preference for males to carry on the family name, was to kill or abort female children and fetuses. Societal and religious teachings and prejudices make the voluntary limiting of births a virtual impossibility. Next time you see a show and someone is introduced and they proudly say they have 6 kids, 24 grand kids, they are the face of the problem. To paraphrase from Jesus, " forgive them for they probably don't know what they have done".

[golfing eagles]

Originally Posted by MartinSE

Not that I agree with them, but you sound like you believe in the cancel culture.

Be careful when “assuming”😂😂😂

[MartinSE]

Originally Posted by golfing eagles

Be careful when “assuming”😂😂😂

I agree entirely; that is why I included the word "like" as in "it seems like"

BTW, while I do disagree with the content of the reference you made - establishing an artificial limit to population, they do have some valid points, in that for the first couple hundred thousand years (a few billion if you don't include people), the population of the earth was naturally limited by factors like exposure, food, disease, etc. And I disagree with enforcing an artificial limit since we now have science and technology that allow more people to survive at a higher standard of living.

And you know, what could go wrong with unbridled population growth artificially supported by science and technology that so many believe to be politically motivated?

[jimjamuser]

Originally Posted by OrangeBlossomBaby

But who would be left to SERVE them, if they kill off the commoners?

Who would clean their toilets, chauffeur them around in their limos, cook and serve their tea and crumpets, polish their silver, bring their trash to the city dump, etc. etc. etc.

No, they need the common man. In fact, the elite wouldn't be capable of survival if the common man were eradicated. No one ever taught them how to be of any practical use. They need us plebians to do everything for them or they'd perish.

America WAS great after WW2 because of the economic strength of the "common man" AKA the middle class.
The elites became like economic "vampire squids" as they sucked the wealth and power of the middle-class gradually away. Today, the upper 90% of America has more wealth than the lower 60%. That change was accomplished gradually and by mechanisms like OUTSOURCING to China and other countries. Now China has our middle class and has military strength and is aggressive toward the US. The decline of UNIONS was "another brick in the wall" toward US degradation.

Someone once said that the only country that can destroy the US is the US itself..........internally.

The elites have used their wealth in places like Florida to build houses and condos right on the barrier islands and the low areas like Fort Meyers. Now Global Warming has told Florida that "it is time to pay the piper". Smarter states like Oregon declared a 1/2 mile exclusion zone of no building on their beaches. The common public has parking places where they can walk or bike to the beach. The rich elites build their large homes where they can see the water from their 2nd stories. It's called a good compromise. In Florida, the elites will take advantage of this current climate change hurricane crisis and buy up Fort Meyers and the Barrier islands. Floridian tax dollars will pay for NEW bridges to those barrier islands so that their chauffer-driven Cadillacs can be driven over them. The middle class of the hurricane survivors with total damage to their homes will be shortchanged by the insurance companies and will not be able to meet the new (stilt basement) codes, which are a somewhat good safety requirement (not as good as the Oregon solution). The new codes will price more of the "common man" out of the area.

The common man will be forced by climate warming conditions to migrate to north central Florida or further north. The elites of Florida will have the wealth to remain on the ecologically dangerous barrier islands of the Florida coast. They may even eventually build some RENTAL condos slightly inland so as to continue to have a source of common-man-type worker bees. Meanwhile, since the last 8 years globally have been the warmest in recorded history, mother nature in the form of hurricanes will continue to BATTER (an often-used word lately) Florida's coast and also other southern states' coasts. Finally, in 2 or 3 years Florida will give up rebuilding and create a no-building zone 1/2 or 1 mile from the rising water line - like Oregon did years ago!

[Byte1]

Originally Posted by justjim

The temperature of our oceans have increased by several degrees according to those that check such things. Warmer temps gives “fuel” to the storms as they approach the coast of the U.S. In addition, the oceans are rising on our coast. Having said that, the majority of scientists tend to call this “climate change”. Some disagree calling it “climate change.” A matter of semantics I suppose? The debate and politics begin when discussion starts over the “cause” of this phenomenon. This phenomenon has become political and since this site has a policy of no political references I will refrain from any comments what may or may not be a cause. Its above my “pay grade”anyway and probably above most who post on TOTV.

The oceans are warmer due to underwater volcanoes. Wait for a few years and it will either get worse or better.

[Byte1]

Originally Posted by jimjamuser

America WAS great after WW2 because of the economic strength of the "common man" AKA the middle class.
The elites became like economic "vampire squids" as they sucked the wealth and power of the middle-class gradually away. Today, the upper 90% of America has more wealth than the lower 60%. That change was accomplished gradually and by mechanisms like OUTSOURCING to China and other countries. Now China has our middle class and has military strength and is aggressive toward the US. The decline of UNIONS was "another brick in the wall" toward US degradation.

Someone once said that the only country that can destroy the US is the US itself..........internally.

The elites have used their wealth in places like Florida to build houses and condos right on the barrier islands and the low areas like Fort Meyers. Now Global Warming has told Florida that "it is time to pay the piper". Smarter states like Oregon declared a 1/2 mile exclusion zone of no building on their beaches. The common public has parking places where they can walk or bike to the beach. The rich elites build their large homes where they can see the water from their 2nd stories. It's called a good compromise. In Florida, the elites will take advantage of this current climate change hurricane crisis and buy up Fort Meyers and the Barrier islands. Floridian tax dollars will pay for NEW bridges to those barrier islands so that their chauffer-driven Cadillacs can be driven over them. The middle class of the hurricane survivors with total damage to their homes will be shortchanged by the insurance companies and will not be able to meet the new (stilt basement) codes, which are a somewhat good safety requirement (not as good as the Oregon solution). The new codes will price more of the "common man" out of the area.

The common man will be forced by climate warming conditions to migrate to north central Florida or further north. The elites of Florida will have the wealth to remain on the ecologically dangerous barrier islands of the Florida coast. They may even eventually build some RENTAL condos slightly inland so as to continue to have a source of common-man-type worker bees. Meanwhile, since the last 8 years globally have been the warmest in recorded history, mother nature in the form of hurricanes will continue to BATTER (an often-used word lately) Florida's coast and also other southern states' coasts. Finally, in 2 or 3 years Florida will give up rebuilding and create a no-building zone 1/2 or 1 mile from the rising water line - like Oregon did years ago!

I think that I have seen that scyfy movie..........

[Byte1]

Originally Posted by fdpaq0580

Welcome to this side if the fence. Over population has always been the underlying cause for most of humankind's problems. Getting couple to willingly limit themselves to two offspring will be tough, if not impossible. China tried limiting the number of children a family could have. The result, due to the societal preference for males to carry on the family name, was to kill or abort female children and fetuses. Societal and religious teachings and prejudices make the voluntary limiting of births a virtual impossibility. Next time you see a show and someone is introduced and they proudly say they have 6 kids, 24 grand kids, they are the face of the problem. To paraphrase from Jesus, " forgive them for they probably don't know what they have done".

Does that extinguish the phrase from GOD "Be Fruitful and Multiply" ??? I believe you mistakenly "paraphrased Jesus" when he was speaking of the elimination of a life, not the reproduction of life. I do not remember a scripture that assumed that GOD (Jesus) would be disappointed in reproduction. Personally, and only my opinion, but I don't see how the world population has made any changes in Climate Change.

[sounding]

And ... we are in a CO2 famine ... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RLnQo8l-BHc

[Byte1]

Are we getting into a review of the "Soylent Green" movie now? Lower the population of the world?

[MartinSE]

Originally Posted by jimjamuser

America WAS great after WW2 because of the economic strength of the "common man" AKA the middle class.
The elites became like economic "vampire squids" as they sucked the wealth and power of the middle-class gradually away. Today, the upper 90% of America has more wealth than the lower 60%. That change was accomplished gradually and by mechanisms like OUTSOURCING to China and other countries. Now China has our middle class and has military strength and is aggressive toward the US. The decline of UNIONS was "another brick in the wall" toward US degradation.

Someone once said that the only country that can destroy the US is the US itself..........internally.

The elites have used their wealth in places like Florida to build houses and condos right on the barrier islands and the low areas like Fort Meyers. Now Global Warming has told Florida that "it is time to pay the piper". Smarter states like Oregon declared a 1/2 mile exclusion zone of no building on their beaches. The common public has parking places where they can walk or bike to the beach. The rich elites build their large homes where they can see the water from their 2nd stories. It's called a good compromise. In Florida, the elites will take advantage of this current climate change hurricane crisis and buy up Fort Meyers and the Barrier islands. Floridian tax dollars will pay for NEW bridges to those barrier islands so that their chauffer-driven Cadillacs can be driven over them. The middle class of the hurricane survivors with total damage to their homes will be shortchanged by the insurance companies and will not be able to meet the new (stilt basement) codes, which are a somewhat good safety requirement (not as good as the Oregon solution). The new codes will price more of the "common man" out of the area.

The common man will be forced by climate warming conditions to migrate to north central Florida or further north. The elites of Florida will have the wealth to remain on the ecologically dangerous barrier islands of the Florida coast. They may even eventually build some RENTAL condos slightly inland so as to continue to have a source of common-man-type worker bees. Meanwhile, since the last 8 years globally have been the warmest in recorded history, mother nature in the form of hurricanes will continue to BATTER (an often-used word lately) Florida's coast and also other southern states' coasts. Finally, in 2 or 3 years Florida will give up rebuilding and create a no-building zone 1/2 or 1 mile from the rising water line - like Oregon did years ago!

There is so little I disagree with in the post, I think you must be playing a trick on me some how (just kidding).

BTW, You know what the corporate tax rate was following the end of WWII, you know the period of the highest levels of investment and growth in the US economy and standard of living? 38% It is 21% today... ahem.

[jimjamuser]

Originally Posted by MartinSE

I agree entirely; that is why I included the word "like" as in "it seems like"

BTW, while I do disagree with the content of the reference you made - establishing an artificial limit to population, they do have some valid points, in that for the first couple hundred thousand years (a few billion if you don't include people), the population of the earth was naturally limited by factors like exposure, food, disease, etc. And I disagree with enforcing an artificial limit since we now have science and technology that allow more people to survive at a higher standard of living.

And you know, what could go wrong with unbridled population growth artificially supported by science and technology that so many believe to be politically motivated?

Wars and diseases are the classic limiting factors on population growth. To me, improved science and technology could be used in both directions - to allow more or fewer people to survive at a greater or lower standard of living. Improved science and technology can be used for greater food production and cleaner air OR it can be used for wars and greater death. Note the world's unease about the use of NUCLEAR missiles in The Ukraine.
......as far as disease goes.......due to the increased world trade and airline flights, diseases can be spread more rapidly and affect more people.
.......so to my mind, improved science and technology just magnifies the 2 basic population controls......namely war and disease. Just as it has been for centuries. For example, before Columbus and the English colonies, the Native American population was huge. The sailing ships bringing the Europeans can be thought of as an improvement in nautical science and technology. The Europeans carried new DISEASES to the Native Americans and their population dropped by something like 90%. You might even say that DISEASES are what the Europeans brought to that famous Thanksgiving dinner?

[MartinSE]

Originally Posted by jimjamuser

Wars and diseases are the classic limiting factors on population growth. To me, improved science and technology could be used in both directions - to allow more or fewer people to survive at a greater or lower standard of living. Improved science and technology can be used for greater food production and cleaner air OR it can be used for wars and greater death. Note the world's unease about the use of NUCLEAR missiles in The Ukraine.
......as far as disease goes.......due to the increased world trade and airline flights, diseases can be spread more rapidly and affect more people.
.......so to my mind, improved science and technology just magnifies the 2 basic population controls......namely war and disease. Just as it has been for centuries. For example, before Columbus and the English colonies, the Native American population was huge. The sailing ships bringing the Europeans can be thought of as an improvement in nautical science and technology. The Europeans carried new DISEASES to the Native Americans and their population dropped by something like 90%. You might even say that DISEASES are what the Europeans brought to that famous Thanksgiving dinner?

All very true, and let's not forget the blankets brought to the new world with the plague to help "control" the indigenous population by combining war(invasion), technology(ships), and disease(plague). Now that is an efficient use of all available methods.

[jimjamuser]

Originally Posted by MartinSE

There is so little I disagree with in the post, I think you must be playing a trick on me some how (just kidding).

BTW, You know what the corporate tax rate was following the end of WWII, you know the period of the highest levels of investment and growth in the US economy and standard of living? 38% It is 21% today... ahem.

Tax rates and tax bracket rate changes for individual tax returns have changed over the years to favor the wealthy and made it harder to balance the budget. Tax changes are another factor in addition to lower union membership and outsourcing to China that has decimated the middle class and pulled the wealth upward toward the upper 10%.

If the wealthy paid their fair share, there would be plenty of federal and state money to relocate and buy housing for those left homeless by hurricane Ian.

Global warming will continue to cause deadly strong hurricanes which will cause continuous dislocations for US people. And crops will fail in South America and drive CLIMATE immigrants illegally northward to further burden the US adding more pollution heating to the planet. Mother Earth is rapidly reaching a tipping point of no return!

[Stu from NYC]

Originally Posted by jimjamuser

Tax rates and tax bracket rate changes for individual tax returns have changed over the years to favor the wealthy and made it harder to balance the budget. Tax changes are another factor in addition to lower union membership and outsourcing to China that has decimated the middle class and pulled the wealth upward toward the upper 90%.

If the wealthy paid their fair share, there would be plenty of federal and state money to relocate and buy housing for those left homeless by hurricane Ian.

Global warming will continue to cause deadly strong hurricanes which will cause continuous dislocations for US people. And crops will fail in South America and drive CLIMATE immigrants illegally northward to further burden the US adding more pollution heating to the planet. Mother earth will become a mother !!!!!!!

Just curious what do you think the fair share of the wealthy to be? 50%, 60% 70%?

BTW it is the wealthy among us that invests in companies that provides many many jobs.

Do you really think the govt spends money efficiently and wisely?

[fdpaq0580]

Originally Posted by Byte1

Does that extinguish the phrase from GOD "Be Fruitful and Multiply" ??? I believe you mistakenly "paraphrased Jesus" when he was speaking of the elimination of a life, not the reproduction of life. I do not remember a scripture that assumed that GOD (Jesus) would be disappointed in reproduction. Personally, and only my opinion, but I don't see how the world population has made any changes in Climate Change.

"Be fruitful and multiply" is not extinguished, but ought to be modified. As it stands it could be call for free love.
God (the Father) didn't seem too thrilled with reproductive/sexual activities of Sodom and Gomorrah.
And, when Jesus admonished the woman to " go and sin no more", I think He may have been referring to sex out of wedlock. Makes me think he might not be too thrilled about unwed mothers with multiple kids, each with a different baby daddy along with the population explosion.
Lastly, I believe you when you say, "I don't see how the world population" (7 to 8 billion people, with their industries, farms, terra forming, pollution, etc, etc, etc) "has made any changes in Climate Change." But, it has.