[ficoguy]

Our career politicians seems scared of China. What they are really scared of is losing the money from China that is being funneled into their campaign coffers thru lobbyists. Its money laundering, political style.

[TexaninVA]

Originally Posted by graciegirl

I can remember the valid reporting of at least one doctor involved in the early treatment of Covid-19 in China that died of Covid-19.

It sounds very unlikely to me that China did it on purpose but people who we can trust will sort it out later when the why becomes more important than saving lives.

Some are in for a penny, in for a pound and throwing all kinds of babies out with the bath water. They are leaping to invalid conclusions and listening to doctors whose careers on Television have kept them out of examining rooms and away from current hands on care of patients for years. People like Drew Pinsky who has since disappeared from appearing on Fox News Network..A very good choice when his statements in March have been discounted as incorrect. (He has since publicly apologized, but probably will not get many chances to appear on TV again as a medical consultant.)

For some, politics become almost like a religion and that is unhealthy. No one person has all of the answers. I am so tired of the flipping back and forth from both sides of the aisle, the incorrect information, the change of subject, the unwarranted attacks on the other side, the mixing of opinion and fact. The limited valid medical people we see in the national information "task force" I am just plain tired, boss. When did we only consult doctors according to their politics or their faithfulness to the person currently in charge of this country???

Those who know me well, know how I usually vote and this subject, Covid-19 has not a damn thing to do with politics.

I think some posters are afraid of confronting the truth about the virus.

It has essentially been proven, or pretty close to it, that “Covid-19” originated in a Chinese lab. That means it’s connected to the Chinese PLA … i.e. their military, and its origins thus trace back to the bio-weapons family so to speak. It’s unclear still if it was unleased deliberately.

More likely, once it got out accidentally, the CCP said, if we’re going to take a hit so will the main enemy … ie the US.

Early on in this discussion, those who pointed out the origination of the virus stemming from a Chinese biowarfare lab as a reasonable theory were derided as “conspiracy theorists.” This is nothing more than the contemporary means of saying “you’re not allowed to say that” or, that’s not PC.

Speaking of PC, a more accurate description of the virus would simply be the “Wuhan virus.” All I’m doing is stating the obvious at this point.

There’s a lesson here. Don’t be too quick to say don’t talk about something if it makes one “uncomfortable” etc. That’s the power of free speech, and the free compilation of evidence to make one’s point … it’s still the best means we have of getting to the truth, even if “uncomfortable.”

[roscoguy]

Originally Posted by TexaninVA

"Although the the U.S. intelligence community early on dismissed the notion that the coronavirus is a synthesized bioweapon, it is still weighing the possibility that the pandemic might have been touched off by an accident at a research facility rather than by an infection from a live-animal market, according to nine current and former intelligence and national security officials familiar with ongoing investigations." Here's the link;

Intelligence officials weigh possibility coronavirus escaped from a Chinese lab

Interesting for sure, but the last I read is that scientists are calling it naturally occurring and discounting the "synthesized bioweapon" aspect.

Originally Posted by TexaninVA

The President was asked during today's news (4/15/20) conference about the possibility that Covid-19 (ie CCP) virus originated in a Chinese Lab. He said the intel community is looking into it.

Here's the link:

President Donald Trump and White House Coronavirus Task Force Daily Press Briefing | FULL — 4/15/20 - YouTube

Go to the 1h14m28s mark and listen to the press question and then the POTUS reply, and then think about what was just said. And then listen to the follow-up question which POTUS declined to answer.

The link above is to a 59:02 video. I'd like to check out what was said, but need a different video.

[roscoguy]

Originally Posted by TexaninVA

It has essentially been proven, or pretty close to it, that “Covid-19” originated in a Chinese lab.

But this has NOT been "proven". It is still speculation that it even leaked from a lab, as a naturally occurring virus. A distinct possibility, it appears, but as yet no more than that.

[TexaninVA]

Originally Posted by roscoguy

Interesting for sure, but the last I read is that scientists are calling it naturally occurring and discounting the "synthesized bioweapon" aspect.




The link above is to a 59:02 video. I'd like to check out what was said, but need a different video.

Video was apparently edited afterwards. Not sure what happened. Go to the current 53m56s mark. POTUS answers the first question and then defers on the second one.

There's also increasing evidence of molecular level engineering in a lab in connection with the AIDS virus. I think the primary question remains --was it an intentional, or accidental, release of the virus? It's also becoming more apparent that, in either case, the CCP lied like crazy afterwards. No surprise there.

The term "weapon" is also interesting. What it has amounted to in practical terms is a "bio-economic" weapon. It's like a CCP weapon "exploded" over the US and killed the economy as opposed to destroying buildings and massive numbers of people.

[DianeM]

Originally Posted by roscoguy

But this has NOT been "proven". It is still speculation that it even leaked from a lab, as a naturally occurring virus. A distinct possibility, it appears, but as yet no more than that.

Are you really still clinging to that nonsense regardless of all the data provided that the virus was being played with in the level 4 lab in Wuhan? I’m not even saying it was on purpose (although I personally think it was).

[roscoguy]

Originally Posted by DianeM

Are you really still clinging to that nonsense regardless of all the data provided that the virus was being played with in the level 4 lab in Wuhan? I’m not even saying it was on purpose (although I personally think it was).

Exactly WHAT data have you provided, Diane? Not opinions from people you know, actual data. I choose to believe the scientific consensus, which presently still appears to be that it is a naturally occurring virus & NOT bio-engineered. Also that there is no evidence of it having leaked from a Chinese lab. If baseless speculation arouses your conspiracy theory antennae, you can go ahead and cling to that nonsense.

Personally, I think that the idea that it was released on purpose is flat out rediculous. But that's my opinion.

[DianeM]

Originally Posted by roscoguy

Exactly WHAT data have you provided, Diane? Not opinions from people you know, actual data. I choose to believe the scientific consensus, which presently still appears to be that it is a naturally occurring virus & NOT bio-engineered. Also that there is no evidence of it having leaked from a Chinese lab. If baseless speculation arouses your conspiracy theory antennae, you can go ahead and cling to that nonsense.

Personally, I think that the idea that it was released on purpose is flat out rediculous. But that's my opinion.

I don’t have to prove jack. All I have to do is pay attention to newscasts and anything but the TV rag. Guess you never watch news on any channel.

[TexaninVA]

Originally Posted by roscoguy

Exactly WHAT data have you provided, Diane? Not opinions from people you know, actual data. I choose to believe the scientific consensus, which presently still appears to be that it is a naturally occurring virus & NOT bio-engineered. Also that there is no evidence of it having leaked from a Chinese lab. If baseless speculation arouses your conspiracy theory antennae, you can go ahead and cling to that nonsense.

Personally, I think that the idea that it was released on purpose is flat out rediculous. But that's my opinion.

This may help you a bit.

"With my colleague, bio-mathematician Jean-Claude Perez, we carefully analyzed the description of the genome of this RNA virus," explains Luc Montagnier, interviewed by Dr Jean-François Lemoine for the daily podcast at Pourquoi Docteur, adding that others have already explored this avenue:

"In order to insert an HIV sequence into this genome, molecular tools are needed, and that can only be done in a laboratory," he added."

Nobel winning scientist who co-discovered HIV claims novel Coronavirus was made in Wuhan's lab

The headline of this link says "Nobel winning scientist who co-discovered HIV claims novel Coronavirus was made in Wuhan's lab" and it's dated 4/18/2020.


Its humorous, and sad, to see the media still trying to peddle the notion of a "conspiracy theory" to discredit what's essentially been factually established. I've already explained what the "conspiracy theory" argument means in practice, so won't repeat it.

Most of the media guys don't seem to have a clue in terms of how they get manipulated by the CCP and the "narrative." Talk about having one's head in a dark place. They become unwitting dupes unfortunately, and what's worse, prevent the public from being fully informed.

Here's a real conspiracy theory for you if you want one: the owners of much of the prestige media are probably making megabucks from China (i.e., CCP) in some form or fashion. If only we had some real investigative journalists .... sigh.

[graciegirl]

Originally Posted by TexaninVA

I think some posters are afraid of confronting the truth about the virus.

It has essentially been proven, or pretty close to it, that “Covid-19” originated in a Chinese lab. That means it’s connected to the Chinese PLA … i.e. their military, and its origins thus trace back to the bio-weapons family so to speak. It’s unclear still if it was unleased deliberately.

More likely, once it got out accidentally, the CCP said, if we’re going to take a hit so will the main enemy … ie the US.

Early on in this discussion, those who pointed out the origination of the virus stemming from a Chinese biowarfare lab as a reasonable theory were derided as “conspiracy theorists.” This is nothing more than the contemporary means of saying “you’re not allowed to say that” or, that’s not PC.

Speaking of PC, a more accurate description of the virus would simply be the “Wuhan virus.” All I’m doing is stating the obvious at this point.

There’s a lesson here. Don’t be too quick to say don’t talk about something if it makes one “uncomfortable” etc. That’s the power of free speech, and the free compilation of evidence to make one’s point … it’s still the best means we have of getting to the truth, even if “uncomfortable.”

I will consider the rest of your opinion when I see a valid entity say it came out of Chinese biowarfare lab. That is just conjecture. I have read and I believe that it happened just like all changes to viruses and other cells happen; through a naturally occurring series of events.

what causes a mutation in a virus - Bing

[roscoguy]

Originally Posted by TexaninVA

Video was apparently edited afterwards. Not sure what happened. Go to the current 53m56s mark. POTUS answers the first question and then defers on the second one.

OK, although 'multiple sources' reporting to FOX News is not exactly proof. I'll admit his answer was pretty responsible: he said "We'll see" rather than fully jumping on that bandwagon.

[roscoguy]

Originally Posted by DianeM

I don’t have to prove jack. All I have to do is pay attention to newscasts and anything but the TV rag. Guess you never watch news on any channel.

So says someone without any proof. You've posted nothing but opinion and far out, baseless theories & then don't understand why others don't automatically prescribe to them...

I do watch news, just not the 'alternative facts' reporting that you seem to.

[roscoguy]

Originally Posted by TexaninVA

This may help you a bit.

"With my colleague, bio-mathematician Jean-Claude Perez, we carefully analyzed the description of the genome of this RNA virus," explains Luc Montagnier, interviewed by Dr Jean-François Lemoine for the daily podcast at Pourquoi Docteur, adding that others have already explored this avenue:

"In order to insert an HIV sequence into this genome, molecular tools are needed, and that can only be done in a laboratory," he added."

Nobel winning scientist who co-discovered HIV claims novel Coronavirus was made in Wuhan's lab

The headline of this link says "Nobel winning scientist who co-discovered HIV claims novel Coronavirus was made in Wuhan's lab" and it's dated 4/18/2020.


Its humorous, and sad, to see the media still trying to peddle the notion of a "conspiracy theory" to discredit what's essentially been factually established. I've already explained what the "conspiracy theory" argument means in practice, so won't repeat it.

Round and round we go. Another article, same site, same day refutes his claim:
" Novel Coronavirus genome sequence finally reveals the origin - natural, not bio-weapon

Scientists analysed the genome sequence of the new Coronavirus

No human error or leak from any lab"

Novel Coronavirus genome sequence finally reveals the origin - natural, not bio-weapon

There are even two dissenting opinions within the article you linked to. I guess it comes down to which experts you want to believe.

I've also given my interpretation of what the term "conspiracy theory" means; no need to go there again either.

Lastly, I'm afraid I still don't see how it's "essentially been factually established" when there are at least as many experts that have said & continue to say that it was a naturally occurring virus.

[DianeM]

Originally Posted by roscoguy

So says someone without any proof. You've posted nothing but opinion and far out, baseless theories & then don't understand why others don't automatically prescribe to them...

I do watch news, just not the 'alternative facts' reporting that you seem to.

Why on earth are you supporting China?

Yes, the virus is naturally occurring but they were messing with it in a lab in Wuhan that we funded in 2015 so they could be as technically savvy as possible. In 2018 their own scientists were saying the handling was sloppy and could end bad.

It could very well be a Typhoid Mary situation. I personally would not put it past them To have done this on purpose since life is meaningless in communist countries. Remember also that they withheld dispersing information on their situation for all of December until reports came out holding their respective hands to the fire. They also got into the pocket of the WHO to minimize their responsibility.

Because of their duplicity, 184 countries are fighting this killer. How can you possibly defend them?

[TexaninVA]

Originally Posted by roscoguy

Round and round we go. Another article, same site, same day refutes his claim:
" Novel Coronavirus genome sequence finally reveals the origin - natural, not bio-weapon

Scientists analysed the genome sequence of the new Coronavirus

No human error or leak from any lab"

Novel Coronavirus genome sequence finally reveals the origin - natural, not bio-weapon

There are even two dissenting opinions within the article you linked to. I guess it comes down to which experts you want to believe.

I've also given my interpretation of what the term "conspiracy theory" means; no need to go there again either.

Lastly, I'm afraid I still don't see how it's "essentially been factually established" when there are at least as many experts that have said & continue to say that it was a naturally occurring virus.

Round and round indeed … at some point hopefully we’ll all know what the truth is. A key point from the beginning is unsheathing the conspiracy theory sword to preempt discussion of a reasonable explanation is not conducive to reaching the truth. Not necessarily saying you did this but some posters in this thread did.

Anyway, we’ll soon find out …maybe. Some of the findings could end up being classified, and for very good reasons.

In the meantime, here’s a discussion between the former American Defense Attaché, who served in Beijing, and American investor Kyle Bass. Brigadier General Spaulding (USAF-Ret) provides his insights on the Chinese in general and CCP in particular.

Is the US-China Trade War a Cold War? (w/ Kyle Bass and Gen. Robert Spalding) - YouTube

One example (at about the 13m mark) is how the CCP strives to control the narrative on topics related to China. That is, they try to control what we (i.e. Americans) are, in effect, “allowed” to think and say about China. They tend to play back our cultural expressions. It’s actually quite clever.

This provides insight into how a topic can become taboo and forbidden by contemporary PC rules. A good example is how the initial discussion of the Wuhan virus as being a product of Chinese biolabs was “forbidden” and quickly scorned by the prestige media as a “conspiracy theory” as already discussed.

The interview was conducted prior to the virus pandemic. I’d be interested people’s thoughtful observations and opinions on the issues the General raises.