[jimjamuser]

Originally Posted by jimjamuser

The way I understand it, Poland had been becoming/leaning authoritarian in the past year, but after Russia attacked the Ukraine, public sentiment in Poland and their President (or Prime Minister) made the shift quickly away from Russia towards the West. A lot of that has to do with the superior PR campaign and work put in by President Zelenskyy and the obvious videos about Russian atrocities - also there is a David vs Goliath concept here.
........That was MY point. I don't care who is OFFICIALLY in NATO. It is about the need for all countries around the world HAVING TO CHOOSE a side. Hungary for example is officially in NATO, but after the recent (tainted) election, Viktor Orban seems to be heading back to his Dictatorial roots and he will favor Russia. This will present a problem for NATO in the future. That was MY point about choosing!
.........I will have to check about Switzerland, but there has been something in the news about their applying for NATO membership. Stay tuned!

Ireland and Austria are definitely looking into NATO membership. Switzerland wants to remain OFFICIALLY neutral, but has many and many increasing military involvements with NATO. Like I said.......the Ukrainian war is causing/forcing many changes.....causing many countries to pick one side or another. As of right now the US has picked and is ALL IN for the Ukraine.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

1. That list dates back to June of last year.
2. The list is of the types of infrastructure that Russia needed to consider "off limits" with regards to cybersecurity.
3. Seems some folks here have forgotten that one time back in band camp, when cybercriminals attacked the country by shutting down one of the existing pipelines, causing gas shortages and creating panic-buying all along the coast.
4. Other cyberattacks were aimed at the Ukranian power grid and a Saudi petrochemical plant.

It's a thing. It's a problem, and it absolutely warrants our President telling Russia not to do that. And sure - even spelling it out in a list of "what not to do" to make sure there's no misunderstanding.

[JMintzer]

Originally Posted by OrangeBlossomBaby

1. That list dates back to June of last year.
2. The list is of the types of infrastructure that Russia needed to consider "off limits" with regards to cybersecurity.
3. Seems some folks here have forgotten that one time back in band camp, when cybercriminals attacked the country by shutting down one of the existing pipelines, causing gas shortages and creating panic-buying all along the coast.
4. Other cyberattacks were aimed at the Ukranian power grid and a Saudi petrochemical plant.

It's a thing. It's a problem, and it absolutely warrants our President telling Russia not to do that. And sure - even spelling it out in a list of "what not to do" to make sure there's no misunderstanding.

OR....

It was an instruction guide of what they should do to screw with us... Potato, Po-tah-to...

[jimjamuser]

Originally Posted by OrangeBlossomBaby

1. That list dates back to June of last year.
2. The list is of the types of infrastructure that Russia needed to consider "off limits" with regards to cybersecurity.
3. Seems some folks here have forgotten that one time back in band camp, when cybercriminals attacked the country by shutting down one of the existing pipelines, causing gas shortages and creating panic-buying all along the coast.
4. Other cyberattacks were aimed at the Ukranian power grid and a Saudi petrochemical plant.

It's a thing. It's a problem, and it absolutely warrants our President telling Russia not to do that. And sure - even spelling it out in a list of "what not to do" to make sure there's no misunderstanding.

Misunderstandings and bad luck have started wars in the past. There was that incident where Gorbachov's generals were misinterpreting their own radar problems as a preemptive launch of missiles by the US. They advised Gorby to launch their Russian missiles for revenge and a 3rd world war. Fortunately, Gorby kept a cool head and a 3rd world war was averted. But, historically, that was a close call !
........Today, we are on a knife's edge.....again.....depending on some KGB strongman to not lose his mind.

[MartinSE]

Originally Posted by jimjamuser

Misunderstandings and bad luck have started wars in the past. There was that incident where Gorbachov's generals were misinterpreting their own radar problems as a preemptive launch of missiles by the US. They advised Gorby to launch their Russian missiles for revenge and a 3rd world war. Fortunately, Gorby kept a cool head and a 3rd world war was averted. But, historically, that was a close call !
........Today, we are on a knife's edge.....again.....depending on some KGB strongman to not lose his mind.

It does feel the world is ramping up. I guess the question is, just how crazy is Putin, and will one of his own decide to take him out before he does something really stupid.

And the old saying goes, "I don't know how WWIII will be fought, but WW IV will be fought with stick and stones."

[MorTech]

Maybe it is just another fear-porn psyop broadcasted on the mass psychosis box.
War propaganda is almost comical. When will Putin bomb a baby milk factory?

[Two Bills]

Originally Posted by jimjamuser

The way I understand it, Poland had been becoming/leaning authoritarian in the past year, but after Russia attacked the Ukraine, public sentiment in Poland and their President (or Prime Minister) made the shift quickly away from Russia towards the West. A lot of that has to do with the superior PR campaign and work put in by President Zelenskyy and the obvious videos about Russian atrocities - also there is a David vs Goliath concept here.
........That was MY point. I don't care who is OFFICIALLY in NATO. It is about the need for all countries around the world HAVING TO CHOOSE a side. Hungary for example is officially in NATO, but after the recent (tainted) election, Viktor Orban seems to be heading back to his Dictatorial roots and he will favor Russia. This will present a problem for NATO in the future. That was MY point about choosing!
.........I will have to check about Switzerland, but there has been something in the news about their applying for NATO membership. Stay tuned!

I wasn't arguing about your 'MY point' or disputing your opinion.
Just replying that both your previous statements regarding Poland and Switzerland were wrong.
That was 'MY point in posting.

[dhdallas]

Ever heard of M.A.D. or Mutually Assured Destruction? The annihilation of millions of Americans (and innocent Russians) would be the result of a war with Russia. Total collapse of both countries (if not the entire world). What a great idea; lets go to war with Russia for trying to hack our systems even though we have been doing the same to them. Go back to your bunker Chicken Little!

[CoachKandSportsguy]

Originally Posted by MartinSE

The real significance is ...., including the US. We are late to the game.

Maybe, but i also think that this an eggageration as I currently work at a multiple product utility, electric (generation, transmission and distribution) and gas (transmission and distribution) and stating we are late to the game would imply that there have been multiple outages due to cyber attacks, and I have yet to read about many cyber outages in the CNI (critical national infrastructure). There is actually more risk in physical attacks now than cyber attacks. . .

Originally Posted by MartinSE

This was particularly interesting to me, ..... I know first hand how poorly prepared our power grid is to deal with a cyber attack.

There are several grids in the US, if you are retired for more than 5-10 years, am thinking that you have missed a lot of continued improvements and upgrades, etc. I know that the PG&E sucked with their use of rate tariffs to adequately cover their physical risks, but most companies are continuously upgrading their cyber defenses. We have tripled our budgets in the last 5 years, and are constantly reducing risk entries. The Columbia gas pipeline explosions were due to failed reactions to over pressurization alerts, and they lost their license to operation in MA. But not a cyber attack.

So i am thinking that you are suffering from retirement memories of the old days, since being out of touch with the current working world advances, which are continuous and hidden from everyday retirement life. Oh I so wish I could be retired to get rid of all this working crap. . and forget about my now irrelevant operational finance career.

So yes, when the increased attacks happen, which have been on going since the beginning of March, internally non cni we have occasional connectivity issues, and slow latency, but nothing has been threatening the CNI any more than any other day.

still working IT guy,
though going back to finance / database dba / regulatory reporting support guy at work

[jimjamuser]

Originally Posted by MartinSE

It does feel the world is ramping up. I guess the question is, just how crazy is Putin, and will one of his own decide to take him out before he does something really stupid.

And the old saying goes, "I don't know how WWIII will be fought, but WW IV will be fought with stick and stones."

I think that US PEOPLE and Russian PEOPLE could exist nicely together as long as both countries could be free of a Dictator or autocratic tendencies......and I do mean both countries!

[jimjamuser]

Originally Posted by MorTech

Maybe it is just another fear-porn psyop broadcasted on the mass psychosis box.
War propaganda is almost comical. When will Putin bomb a baby milk factory?

I fail to understand the point of such statements. There are VAGUE allusions to some.........whatever???? is the main point of the paragraph/series of statements?

[MartinSE]

Originally Posted by dhdallas

Ever heard of M.A.D. or Mutually Assured Destruction? The annihilation of millions of Americans (and innocent Russians) would be the result of a war with Russia. Total collapse of both countries (if not the entire world). What a great idea; lets go to war with Russia for trying to hack our systems even though we have been doing the same to them. Go back to your bunker Chicken Little!

Excuse me, how did we get from the government sending out alerts to companies to check for this particular type or hacking, to declaring war on Russia?

If Russia attacks the US what is your recommendation? Learn Russian?

[jimjamuser]

Originally Posted by Two Bills

I wasn't arguing about your 'MY point' or disputing your opinion.
Just replying that both your previous statements regarding Poland and Switzerland were wrong.
That was 'MY point in posting.

To me, it did NOT seem like a clarifying reply. It seemed more like an attack and a delighted finding of fault with another person's post. In addition to a non-comment or opinion on the main point of MY post.
.......When anyone writes a reply of more than 5 or 6 sentences. There is always someone that will "pull out" a small detail and declare that a small detail of near-zero IMPORTANCE somehow nullifies the main argument of a post. Maybe it is human nature.....a dark human nature.

[MartinSE]

Originally Posted by jimjamuser

I think that US PEOPLE and Russian PEOPLE could exist nicely together as long as both countries could be free of a Dictator or autocratic tendencies......and I do mean both countries!

I am not a history person, but (there is always a but) it seems to me that all wars are wars of rich powerful people that the young, poor and powerless are sent to fight and die in so that the rich and powerful person can become more rich and powerful. I will go a step further and say the rich and powerful person is typically a sociopath, which has no emotional connection to other people, and so looks at loss of life in war as a "cost of doing business" and is only considered for how it impacts their personal wealth or power.

The first step in most wars is for "the people" to be convinced the other side are evil demons out to destroy "the people", and so "the people" must defend themselves (and their children) by taking action.

Remember when WE invaded Iraq, all the fear mongering and the online campaign to make Hussain out to be evil incarnate. They forgot to mention WE trained him, WE funded his rise to power, WE supplied him with the weapons he needed. WE stoked the fire, and then had to go to war with him because he got out of control. And who paid the price, hundreds of thousands of civilians in Iraq and Afghanistan, and many American soldiers. And the rich and powerful (corporations) made over $3 Trillion supplying the war machine, while our infrastructure feel apart.

Putin, in my not so humble opinion is a sociopath. He is following the same script, "He has to purge the NAZIs threatening mother Russia!" Most autocrats are sociopaths - approximately 5% of the worlds population are sociopath - 15 million Americans or 1 out of every 20 of your neighbors are.

It is more likely for a sociopath to gain positions of power and wealth because they do not play by rules, since rules do not apply to them. However, most powerful sociopaths are rich and powerful because they are very good at manipulating people. They are often surrounded by a cult following. I AM NOT TALKING ABOUT ANY PARTICULAR LEADER. I am talking about Jones, Putin, Hitler, Mussolini, etc. etc. etc.

To the point of your post. I firmly believe that "people" all would more or less get along fine without the sociopaths pushing misinformation. Most people want to raise their families. Make the world a better place for their kids. Keep their kids healthy and safe. Most people don't REALLY care what form of government they live under, as long as it leaves them alone to do what they want. It is the leaders that have to stir the pot, get people mad at other people.

[MartinSE]

Originally Posted by jimjamuser

When anyone writes a reply of more than 5 or 6 sentences. There is always someone that will "pull out" a small detail and declare that a small detail of near-zero IMPORTANCE somehow nullifies the main argument of a post. Maybe it is human nature.....a dark human nature.

Tell me about it - LOL! I tend to ramble on and on. And boy do people like finding some little detail (typo even) to pull out and rant over. Oh well, there are a few that want to actually discuss things and not just shout their dog whistles. I just need to learn to better control my "temper" and ignore those.