[Bavarian]

Originally Posted by buggyone

The poster who copied a section of the Catholic catechism regarding homosexual behavior has to remember that is man made religious law.

The Catholic Church has written the new Catechism to better inform the faithful of the Faith especially after the Vatican II changes. If you are not a Catholic of what interest is this to you?

The discipline of Celibacy is made by The Church and it could change, but the Doctrine of an All-male priesthood was instituted by Christ and can not change.

Re this discussion on homosexuals, the Church has never hated anyone, just teaches against the sin. As would any religion do with regard to any sinner, of which we all are.

[Villages PL]

Originally Posted by jane032657

Excuse me but being gay has nothing to do with pedophilia. The sexual abuse of children by Priests has nothing to do with sexuality, it has to do with opportunity, power, control, and abuse. Being gay is no different than being straight, except in who you choose for your partner. Life is the same and your assumption to me in mortifying.

Excuse me but a priest who likes boys is gay. In other words, if a priest comes out as being gay it doesn't preclude him being a pedophile.

[Villages PL]

Originally Posted by Golfingnut

I would think he made the day for thousands of gay priests giving them the opertunity to come out. Very bold move for the Catholic Church.

The heading of this thread is amazinly suggestive: The Pope on Gay Priests: Am I the only who gets that?

[gomoho]

Originally Posted by Villages PL

The heading of this thread is amazinly suggestive: The Pope on Gay Priests: Am I the only who gets that?

HAhahahahahahaha

[ijusluvit]

Here what was actually said...

“If someone is gay and he searches for the Lord and has good will, who am I to judge?” Francis told reporters, speaking in Italian but using the English word “gay.”

Francis’s words could not have been more different from those of Benedict XVI, who in 2005 wrote that homosexuality was “a strong tendency ordered toward an intrinsic moral evil,” and an “objective disorder.”

It is a profoundly important shift that Pope Francis will not judge gays (just as Christ chose not to do). His predecessor reinforced what he saw as an inexorable connection between homosexuality and intrinsic moral evil (i.e. having forbidden sex, pedophilia, and other forms of sexual abuse). The 'connection' was his judgement of homosexuals, and his leadership led many church leaders and members to make those judgements also. Those who were known to be gay have been shunned, despised and denied participation in church sacraments and ceremonies.

What's important is that the official papal authorization to continue discrimination against gays based on a judgement of their assumed behavior has been removed.

[ilovetv]

Originally Posted by ijusluvit

Here what was actually said...

“If someone is gay and he searches for the Lord and has good will, who am I to judge?” Francis told reporters, speaking in Italian but using the English word “gay.”

Francis’s words could not have been more different from those of Benedict XVI, who in 2005 wrote that homosexuality was “a strong tendency ordered toward an intrinsic moral evil,” and an “objective disorder.”

It is a profoundly important shift that Pope Francis will not judge gays (just as Christ chose not to do). His predecessor reinforced what he saw as an inexorable connection between homosexuality and intrinsic moral evil (i.e. having forbidden sex, pedophilia, and other forms of sexual abuse). The 'connection' was his judgement of homosexuals, and his leadership led many church leaders and members to make those judgements also. Those who were known to be gay have been shunned, despised and denied participation in church sacraments and ceremonies.

What's important is that the official papal authorization to continue discrimination against gays based on a judgement of their assumed behavior has been removed.

This statement, “If someone is gay and he searches for the Lord and has good will, who am I to judge?” does not refer to priests who made vows of celibacy but choose to have sexual relations. It refers to all human beings in general, regarding their faith.

It says in another way that only God knows a person's heart and and only He knows the honesty/integrity of the person's faith, and that the pope does not judge the validity/truthfulness of the person's faith.

The pope does have the right/authority to "judge" (identify and call to repentance) any person whose chosen behavior defies God by breaking His Commandments.

It would be grossly mistaken to conclude that the pope and Catholic doctrine will no longer deem homosexual behavior to be prohibited, condemnable and alienating from God.

Within the professing Catholic human population, there is a subset of people--priests--over whom the Pope does have authority to declare their homosexual behavior to be prohibited and condemnable. This thread was mis-titled I think, by focusing on priests.

As for the pope's statement saying "who am I to judge (a person's faith)", a priest can be homosexual in his being and mental/emotional attractions to others without being "judged" by the pope or God, but the behavior of acting upon those attractions and having sexual relations is prohibited and will continue to be "judged" (identified and called to repentance) by the Church.

As always, people tend to interpret religious doctrine to make it fit their personal and political wants, instead of conforming to what God wants and what the Church teaches in order to draw the person nearer to God and his perfection in eternity.

[ijusluvit]

Originally Posted by ilovetv

This statement, “If someone is gay and he searches for the Lord and has good will, who am I to judge?” does not refer to priests who made vows of celibacy but choose to have sexual relations. It refers to all human beings in general, regarding their faith.

It says in another way that only God knows a person's heart and and only He knows the honesty/integrity of the person's faith, and that the pope does not judge the validity/truthfulness of the person's faith.

The pope does have the right/authority to "judge" (identify and call to repentance) any person whose chosen behavior defies God by breaking His Commandments.

It would be grossly mistaken to conclude that the pope and Catholic doctrine will no longer deem homosexual behavior to be prohibited, condemnable and alienating from God.

Within the general human population, there is a subset of people (priests) over whom the Pope does have authority to declare their homosexual behavior to be prohibited and condemnable. This thread was mis-titled I think, by focusing on priests.

As for the pope's statement saying "who am I to judge (a person's faith), a priest can be homosexual in his being and mental/emotional attractions to others without being "judged" by the pope or God, but the behavior of acting upon those attractions and having sexual relations is prohibited.

As always, people tend to interpret religious doctrine to make it fit their personal and political wants, instead of conforming to what God wants and what the Church teaches in order to draw the person nearer to God and his perfection in eternity.

I'm not sure how any of your statements change the facts about this important shift in the church's position on gays.

In the first paragraph you could extend Francis' statement to include more than gay priests. If that were true it wouldn't change anything, but it would make the shift even more global.
Next paragraph is a bulls-eye, and a virtual restatement of my position.
Next paragraph misses the point. Francis says he will not judge people. It says nothing of judging behavior.
Next paragraph - answered above. In fact the Pope and other church leaders have the authority to judge the behavior of any Catholic.
Next paragraph - ok, you again distinguish between a group of people and human behavior. That's the idea.
Last paragraph - Not sure to whom you are referring and how it fits this issue.

[zonerboy]

The pope said that he did not feel it was his place to judge persons who have a homosexual (gay) orientation, particularly when they are persons of good will who are seeking a relationship with God.
He did not give homosexual priests permission to break their vows of celibacy, or to become sexually active, or to engage in sexual acts with minors.
We are all sinners, by the way. And it is not our job to be pointing fingers at others and claiming their sin is way worse than our own. Just leave the judging to God. That's God's job.

[graciegirl]

Originally Posted by zonerboy

The pope said that he did not feel it was his place to judge persons who have a homosexual (gay) orientation, particularly when they are persons of good will who are seeking a relationship with God.
He did not give homosexual priests permission to break their vows of celibacy, or to become sexually active, or to engage in sexual acts with minors.
We are all sinners, by the way. And it is not our job to be pointing fingers at others and claiming their sin is way worse than our own. Just leave the judging to God. That's God's job.

Good morning zonerboy. You speak kindly and with wisdom.

[Barefoot]

Originally Posted by zonerboy

The pope said that he did not feel it was his place to judge persons who have a homosexual (gay) orientation, particularly when they are persons of good will who are seeking a relationship with God.
He did not give homosexual priests permission to break their vows of celibacy, or to become sexually active, or to engage in sexual acts with minors.
We are all sinners, by the way. And it is not our job to be pointing fingers at others and claiming their sin is way worse than our own. Just leave the judging to God. That's God's job.

Your post is a breath of fresh air.

[Schaumburger]

Originally Posted by jane032657

Excuse me but being gay has nothing to do with pedophilia. The sexual abuse of children by Priests has nothing to do with sexuality, it has to do with opportunity, power, control, and abuse. Being gay is no different than being straight, except in who you choose for your partner. Life is the same and your assumption to me in mortifying.

Thank you, jane, for this post.

[Schaumburger]

Originally Posted by graciegirl

The Catholic church moves VERY slowly to change and has many, many difficulties with acceptance of knowledge that we all know is more valid than what it espouses.

BUT...it makes my old heart happy to see a truly kind man with a loving heart walk in the white robes. Perhaps he will move The Catholic Church forward. But don't expect too much.

Gracie, Agree with you on that. I had too many disagreements with the Catholic church hierarchy to call myself a Catholic. So I left the Catholic church in 1996 and joined the Episcopal church. Close to half of the people at my church are former Catholics.

[gomoho]

Originally Posted by Schaumburger

Gracie, Agree with you on that. I had too many disagreements with the Catholic church hierarchy to call myself a Catholic. So I left the Catholic church in 1996 and joined the Episcopal church. Close to half of the people at my church are former Catholics.

I too chose to leave the Catholic church a while back, but Pope Francis certainly has my attention. He seems to really walk the walk.

[Bavarian]

And the Anglicans are returning to Rome, at least they were under Pope Benedict XVI, no women "priests", etc.

[duffysmom]

Originally Posted by Bavarian

And the Anglicans are returning to Rome, at least they were under Pope Benedict XVI, no women "priests", etc.

Somehow I doubt this but if true, how sad.