Originally Posted by samhass

I certainly wish "There are no jobs Americans won't do," was true. The question is how well will they do those jobs? Many of our offspring have an incredible sense of entitlement. I still contend that a man/woman unwilling
to give you an honest days labor at a lower wage scale will not work any better at a higher wage. It's about work ethic and many Americans need a healthy dose. I am not painting all Americans with this brush. Many of us have worked exceptionally hard and have sacrificed to live the American dream. Many are still doing so. I just don't buy into the argument that all Americans are hardworking. I do know many Americans will not be willing to pay the price of goods if we get rid of all the alien laborers.

So then it is perfectly fine to:

1.pay people below minimum wage.
2.not pay FICA, state unemployment insurance and the employer pocket the money.
3. expect county indigent health care funds to cover the health coverage of these workers and their families
4. condone identity theft via phony SS Cards and other ID cards
5. keep factories and other such facilities at below-OSHA requirements because the labor won't complain out of fear of being deported
6. continue having more and more jobs get "demoted" in pay and working conditions because there's always an illegal willing to do the job at any money
7. turn a blind eye on the living conditions of most illegals who try to live on slave wages because "out of sight, oout of mind"
8. and tthe biggest of them all - ignore 1-7 above because I don't want the prices of my goods to go up, no matter who gets hurt along the way.

I understand the motivation of the illegal allien who will do anything to support his/her family. I also understand and have seen first-hand over-and-over-again the results of the employer extortion and exploitation of these people - all to lower overhead and rise profits - knowing full well that most American consumers don't care, as long as the price of lettuce doesn't go over $2 a head, meat doesn't cost more, the grass gets cut cheaper than the lawn service which pays its employees according to the law of the land, and all such situations.

It's amazing how we can complain when our jobs and benefits get leveled or reduced, but don't give a hoot about the REAL economic slavery going on all around us.

And Chels - all the Bush bashing in the world has nothing to do with sleight-of-hand funding for ACORN, NEA, condom delivery and the other pork products which have NOTHING to do with any economic stimulus. George Bush is out of office - get over it - and if Pres Obama delivers on his campaign promises, GOOD! So far, he has hedged and reneged on his "consensus with tthe people" and anti-pork rhetoric, and is a willing participant in getting special interests funded through buried line items in the DEMOCRATIC-WRITTEN stimulus bill. So far, he's just shown himself as the Reid/Pelosi cheerleader on party-partisan, budget-swelling, payback-to-special-interest legislation. I don't care if he has been in office two days or two years. You don't get a "breaking-in period" as President - and he and his party leadership know that.

Oh yeah - condom makers, "artists" funded by NEA and ACORN employees need their jobs protected, too. What a crock!

Originally Posted by KayakerNC

And employing the Geezer and the Dingbat would have been somehow smart???

I am sure you must be alluding to US Senator John McCain and Gov. Sarah Palin with your comments.

My reply to your question would be YES !!!!

It was discussed many times on this board that the McCain/Palin ticket was not one to get excited about, but the alternative was worse and we are seeing the results ALREADY, which is what shocks me...the speed and shocking jamming down our throats.

During the campaign, many said we are electing someone who is schooled and knows only socialism and we will give him a congress that is extreme left and socialist. Now, we have a "stimulus plan" that is becoming a total spending binge to support anything and everything socialist and we are told we must do it NOW. The same man who was so vociferious about the "politics of fear" is doing the same thing.

I suppose those who supported him want this, although the polls seem to be switching but you and I and all of us know that congress does not care...no matter how much the polls reflect our fear of this plan, there is no consideration of that....fact is the leaders keep saying how much we want it and that isnt a fact !!!!!

Kyaker,

No, I don't the GOP ticket would have been "somehow smart". And if you took my comments as an endorsement of the GOP ticket, you are wrong and you missed the point.

Actually, I think there were better choices available to both parties, and they both sold us down the river with their respective nominees.

Have a nice day!

Originally Posted by Fourpar

Kyaker,

No, I don't the GOP ticket would have been "somehow smart". And if you took my comments as an endorsement of the GOP ticket, you are wrong and you missed the point.

Actually, I think there were better choices available to both parties, and they both sold us down the river with their respective nominees.

Have a nice day!

Originally Posted by Fourpar

Kyaker,

No, I don't the GOP ticket would have been "somehow smart". And if you took my comments as an endorsement of the GOP ticket, you are wrong and you missed the point.

Actually, I think there were better choices available to both parties, and they both sold us down the river with their respective nominees.

Have a nice day!

I can't wait to see the next bailout of our banking sytem coming down down the road.

Originally Posted by Fourpar

Kyaker,
No, I don't the GOP ticket would have been "somehow smart". And if you took my comments as an endorsement of the GOP ticket, you are wrong and you missed the point.
Actually, I think there were better choices available to both parties, and they both sold us down the river with their respective nominees.
Have a nice day!

There were better choices available to the respective parties. But we have to play the hand they deal us.
It seems that the only choices for the voters were "Change", "More of the Same", or "Useless". "Change" won by a convincing majority.

you outlined.....NO MATTER WHO WINS THE ELECTION!!

Just look at the more of the same circus that is underway with the pork filled stimulous package.

The only change evident to date is the fact there is a new POTUS with a whole slew of appointed Washington insiders.

And that is all that has changed to date. Oooops I forgot the other evident change is the retraction by the now POTUS that promises made during the campaign will be difficult to deliver.

We are suffering from more of the same propelled by an on the job training POTUS.

BTK

to the fact the bill the POTUS is ranting about is not a real stimulus plan.

While this is only one take (of many) it is revealing enough that we the people should be writing to our representatives to squash it and go for a REAL program:

http://inhofe.senate.gov/public/inde...5-a737ffca72f7

Where is the jobs opportunity?
Where is the energy independence plan, which by itself would open substantial opportunities for jobs?
The spending programs do none of the above. So why are we the people letting the likes of Pelosi and Obama run us in the wrong direction?

Obama has put a check mark in the box for closing Gitmo. Big deal. Wait till you see what it does not do. And how much it will cost to relocate the terrorists. As well as allow some to return to their task of killing Americans.

Obama is exhibiting frustration that the bill, which is minimally stimulus, over it not being passed. Why? Because he wants to get another box checked in the first 100 days....whether it does the job or not.

The forecast is to be worse off one year from now as a result.

What is it going to take? I for one am in favor of a revolution. Yes, all out war against the Washington gang, including Obama, that are not doing what is needed.

SPENDING WILL NOT MAKE IT HAPPEN!!!!!!!!!!!!

Wait until the terrorist attack happens. Wait until the oil supply to the USA is interrupted.

We can live here in TV and feel secure. Well if you haven't experienced shortages from the panic buying here, just wait. What has happenined to date is only a precursor to the future.

What is it going to take...for we the people to wake up? Before it is too late...if it isn't already!!

BTK

Sen Inhofe is against the stimulus plan?
All the more reason to be in favor of it.

All he had to do was to get impatient with his own congress. The executive right thing to do was to tell them to take the bill back....strip out the pork....because I the candidate said there would be no pork on his watch.

But no. Instead he elects to take those that are fighting the pork, to task. Hence condoning what the Queen of Pork (Pelosi) is ram rodding.

Is he telegraphing he really doesn't want to impose on her turf?

To challenge his Congress to do what he pledged to the people would have been the right thing to do. Instead he chose to take the same-o same-o political position of not rocking the party boat.
Too bad. Doing what he promised or doing what is right did not get ANT play in his decision making.
For those of us waiting to see if he does the right thing....it is a disappointment....not a surprise...a disappointment...no walking the talk....just another politician.

BTK

Reduce Corp income tax to lowest in the world.

Zero Corp Income tax for any new mfg operation. manufacturing in the United States.

No capital gains tax for 10 years.

Make the Bush tax breaks perm.

Give $10,000 to every American citizen age 18 or over.

Give $15,000 tword the purchase of a primary resident. Must reside in it for 5 years.

As far as roads and bridges go, we have been paying for these through our taxes already. They have been wasting the money elsewhere.

Oh, I almost forgot. QUIT BLAMING GEORGE BUSH! There is a new guy responsible now.

Originally Posted by Yoda

Oh, I almost forgot. QUIT BLAMING GEORGE BUSH! There is a new guy responsible now.

Yeah! After all, it's not like he dug the deep pit we find ourselves in now...........oh, wait.

Originally Posted by KayakerNC

Yeah! After all, it's not like he dug the deep pit we find ourselves in now...........oh, wait.

Your defense of President Obama is admirable, and there is much validity to your point about the previous administration, although I, personally, place much more blame on the congress than the President. I DO blame him for not handling the first TARP payment appropriately for sure..he and Paulson.

Having said that, these first few weeks have completely floored me, even though I totally expected much of what is going on, just not this quickly.

I am struck that he campaigned against what he called "politics of fear"...yet he is practicing the same thing now.

I am struck that a man who more than anyone in recent memory campaigned on ethics.....yet he publicly defended folks who had not paid taxes and he knew it at the time he was defending them...of course he said "my screwup" AFTER it was too late. He says he did not push them to drop out and I ask WHY DIDNT HE ?

I am struck that a man who preached over and over that there would be NO PORK, is allowing and pushing for a bill totally loaded with a ton of it, EVEN TO THE DISGUST OF fellow Democrats.

I spoke against his election....gave many many reasons during the campaign. I knew I would be shown to be correct (for once in my stupid life, this was a no brainer_, but actually held hope that perhaps I was wrong and he was actually different than I thought and different than what we have had but it sure appears that President Obama is not only the same but much much more scarier because he has the likes of Rep Pelosi and Sen Reid

I watched most of the debate on the "Stimulus" package on C-SPAN 2. The most articulate and thoughtful speaker was.....John McCain. What we ended up with is "More of the same, you can believe in."
So this stimulus package is polling at 37% approvel. Obama is currenlty polling at 61% approvel. Let's watch that number.

Making his case in the most dire terms, President Barack Obama said that "if Congress does not quickly pass an economic stimulus package, the nation will slip into a crisis so deep that "we may be unable to reverse it."

What a disgraceful self serving lie.