[Stu from NYC]

Originally Posted by golfing eagles

IF, and I mean IF both were true (grudge and death from intoxicants), which is usually a big IF, then which of the a$$h0!3 rioters and looters would be the first to apologize????

Dont hold your breath waiting on an apology. Terrible what the cop did but to destroy in the name of it is just wrong and the looters should be in jail and be fined in accordance with the damage they did.

[dewilson58]

Originally Posted by manaboutown

Medical Examiner: No Evidence George Floyd Died Of Strangulation; ‘Underlying Conditions,’ ‘Potential Intoxicants’ Likely Factors | The Daily Wire

So the knee did not kill him??


When it states "restrained"..............is that handcuff restraint??

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Originally Posted by manaboutown

There may have been a personal grudge...George Floyd & Fired Cop Worked Security Together at Club: Report

Originally Posted by manaboutown

Just found another article. George Floyd, Arresting Officer Worked Together: Club Owner

Originally Posted by manaboutown

Medical Examiner: No Evidence George Floyd Died Of Strangulation; ‘Underlying Conditions,’ ‘Potential Intoxicants’ Likely Factors | The Daily Wire

See here for actual information fact-checked:
Did George Floyd and Then-Officer Derek Chauvin Work Together in Minneapolis?

As for the Daily Wire - they are not a reliable source of information. The "potential intoxicants" phrase was taken out of context, and included intentionally to muddy the facts of the murder with supposition and doubt. There is no evidence at this point that George Floyd was intoxicated at the time of his murder.

[ColdNoMore]

Originally Posted by OrangeBlossomBaby

See here for actual information fact-checked:
Did George Floyd and Then-Officer Derek Chauvin Work Together in Minneapolis?

As for the Daily Wire - they are not a reliable source of information. The "potential intoxicants" phrase was taken out of context, and included intentionally to muddy the facts of the murder with supposition and doubt. There is no evidence at this point that George Floyd was intoxicated at the time of his murder.

Given the importance of getting it right and the history of Minnesota's LEO community as a whole, I would like to see additional autopsies performed by out-of-state and uninvolved, highly-trained ME's...then let them make their findings as a group.

After all, what do we really know about the MN Medical Examiner... who put out this information?

No one who wants the actual truth...should have any problem with doing this.

[graciegirl]

On Friday and Saturday nights I watch Live PD. I watch it because it soothes something in myself to see an attempt to curb wrong doing and to stop bad things and to handle the sea of people who break the law and for whom the police are called. There are always about eight to ten police groups from all over the country and they change from time to time. It is edited so as you do not see horrible things and there is a pause in presentation, but it is an accurate view of what police officers are doing out "there" day in day out. One of the police groups it follows is in Lawrence, Indiana, a suburb of Indianapolis where we once lived. One of the police officers that is followed is a man called Charles Kingery. Here is a very honest sharing of his opinion on the George Floyd incident.

Tina Cafarelli - Charlie Kingery express his feelings of...

[manaboutown]

Originally Posted by OrangeBlossomBaby

See here for actual information fact-checked:
Did George Floyd and Then-Officer Derek Chauvin Work Together in Minneapolis?

As for the Daily Wire - they are not a reliable source of information. The "potential intoxicants" phrase was taken out of context, and included intentionally to muddy the facts of the murder with supposition and doubt. There is no evidence at this point that George Floyd was intoxicated at the time of his murder.

Snopes is not a reliable fact checker. It is well known to be a left wing biased site. The club owner herself was quoted in one article.

[John_W]

Originally Posted by ColdNoMore

Given the importance of getting it right and the history of Minnesota's LEO community as a whole, I would like to see additional autopsies performed by out-of-state and uninvolved, highly-trained ME's...then let them make their findings as a group.

After all, what do we really know about the MN Medical Examiner... who put out this information?

No one who wants the actual truth...should have any problem with doing this.

Before you begin to defame a medical doctor's reputation, there is always Google.

ANDREW BAKER, BS, MD

Chief Medical Examiner Hennepin County (Minn.)
Dr. Baker has been a featured presenter at a National Institute of Justice sponsored event.

Andrew Baker, MD is a graduate of the University of Iowa. He completed his pathology residency at the University of Iowa, and a forensic pathology fellowship in Minneapolis. He is board-certified in anatomic, clinical, and forensic pathology. He is a fellow of the College of American Pathologists, the American Academy of Forensic Sciences, and the National Association of Medical Examiners.

Dr. Baker has served as a guest lecturer at the US Army Judge Advocate General's School, the Naval Justice School, The University of Minnesota Law School, Hamline Law School, Harvard Law School, the Ontario Forensic Pathology Service, and the Royal College of Pathologists of Australasia.

Prior to practicing as a forensic pathologist with the Hennepin County Medical Examiner in Minneapolis, Dr. Baker served four years as a medical examiner in the US Air Force. He was appointed to the position of Chief Medical Examiner for Hennepin County in 2004, and was reappointed in 2008, 2012, and 2016.

Dr. Michael Baden to perform independent autopsy on George Floyd

[ColdNoMore]

Originally Posted by ColdNoMore

Given the importance of getting it right and the history of Minnesota's LEO community as a whole, I would like to see additional autopsies performed by out-of-state and uninvolved, highly-trained ME's...then let them make their findings as a group.

After all, what do we really know about the MN Medical Examiner... who put out this information?

No one who wants the actual truth...should have any problem with doing this.

I'll say it again.

[Heyitsrick]

Originally Posted by OrangeBlossomBaby

See here for actual information fact-checked:
Did George Floyd and Then-Officer Derek Chauvin Work Together in Minneapolis?

As for the Daily Wire - they are not a reliable source of information. The "potential intoxicants" phrase was taken out of context, and included intentionally to muddy the facts of the murder with supposition and doubt. There is no evidence at this point that George Floyd was intoxicated at the time of his murder.

Where is your contention coming from re: "taken out of context, and included intentionally to muddy the facts of the murder with supposition and doubt"?

Here's the exact quote, taken directly from the State of Minnesota complaint against the officer:

"The Hennepin County Medical Examiner (ME) conducted Mr. Floyd’s autopsy on May 26, 2020. The full report of the ME is pending but the ME has made the following preliminary findings. The autopsy revealed no physical findings that support a diagnosis of traumatic asphyxia or strangulation. Mr. Floyd had underlying health conditions including coronary artery disease and hypertensive heart disease. The combined effects of Mr. Floyd being restrained by the police, his underlying health conditions and any potential intoxicants in his system likely contributed to his death."

If you read the complaint, you'll see there are the body cam accounts of what happened. All of the "Floyd didn't resist..." comments we can all read in this forum are countered directly by the body cam footage - according to the complaint.

Apparently the officers involved tried several times to get Floyd into their squad car. Floyd resisted. He actively resisted being handcuffed, according to the complaint. He apparently started saying he couldn't breathe while still standing.

Continuing from the official complaint:

"The officers made several attempts to get Mr. Floyd in the backseat of squad 320 from the driver’s side. Mr. Floyd did not voluntarily get in the car and struggled with the officers by intentionally falling down, saying he was not going in the car, and refusing to stand still. Mr. Floyd is over six feet tall and weighs more than 200 pounds."

The defendant (officer) put him down on the ground and held him in place with the knee, as we all know.

If this complaint is reflecting actual audio as well as video, it's quite clear there is much more to this event than has been portrayed.

That said, does that exonerate the officer who restrained Floyd for many minutes - even after, apparently, no pulse could be determined? Absolutely not. And you won't find me making that case. But this is seemingly another event where first impressions aren't telling the whole story.

Here is the official Minnesota complaint with amplifying information about this incident: https://assets.documentcloud.org/doc...-Complaint.pdf

[manaboutown]

George Floyd Autopsy Finds No Evidence of Asphyxia or Strangulation, Family Plans Second Examination

[Velvet]

They might find that George Floyd actually died from Covid, but that does not change the fact that kneeing on him was not released when he couldn’t breathe.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Originally Posted by Heyitsrick

Where is your contention coming from re: "taken out of context, and included intentionally to muddy the facts of the murder with supposition and doubt"?

Here's the exact quote, taken directly from the State of Minnesota complaint against the officer:

"The Hennepin County Medical Examiner (ME) conducted Mr. Floyd’s autopsy on May 26, 2020. The full report of the ME is pending but the ME has made the following preliminary findings. The autopsy revealed no physical findings that support a diagnosis of traumatic asphyxia or strangulation. Mr. Floyd had underlying health conditions including coronary artery disease and hypertensive heart disease. The combined effects of Mr. Floyd being restrained by the police, his underlying health conditions and any potential intoxicants in his system likely contributed to his death."

If you read the complaint, you'll see there are the body cam accounts of what happened. All of the "Floyd didn't resist..." comments we can all read in this forum are countered directly by the body cam footage - according to the complaint.

Apparently the officers involved tried several times to get Floyd into their squad car. Floyd resisted. He actively resisted being handcuffed, according to the complaint. He apparently started saying he couldn't breathe while still standing.



That said, does that exonerate the officer who restrained Floyd for many minutes - even after, apparently, no pulse could be determined? Absolutely not. And you won't find me making that case. But this is seemingly another event where first impressions aren't telling the whole story.

Here is the official Minnesota complaint with amplifying information about this incident: https://assets.documentcloud.org/doc...-Complaint.pdf

Some people are concluding, wrongly, that the ME's determination was final and comprehensive, because some people are reading snippets with missing words - such as the ones in your quote that I bolded, italicized, and underlined.

People are basing their opinions on the falsehood that this PRELIMINARY, INCOMPLETE examination proved that...

1. George Floyd was able to resist AT THE TIME THE VIRAL VIDEO WAS RECORDED...
2. George Floyd was absolutely intoxicated...
3. George Floyd was a threat to the four officers,
4. Chauvin was the only one subduing George Floyd
5. Chauvin did what he was trained to do...
6. Chauvin didn't kill George Floyd
7. Chauvin didn't know Floyd was either dead OR unconscious and therefore incapable of knowing that he was trying to subdue a dead (or unconscious) man.

There are people basing their vilification of George Floyd and vindication of Chauvin on this preliminary, incomplete medical examination.

And there are people hopping on that bandwagon on purpose, spurring it on, encouraging people to vilify Floyd and vindicate Chauvin, because it helps them create the wars, riots, looting, hatred, division, and split from humanity that they are intentionally trying to create.

[manaboutown]

Originally Posted by Velvet

They might find that George Floyd actually died from Covid, but that does not change the fact that kneeing on him was not released when he couldn’t breathe.

If I were being strangled to the point I could not breath I doubt I could speak out and say "I can't breath." as that would be physically impossible for me to do.

From what I have read Floyd was saying he could not breath while he was still standing, before he was ever put down on the ground for not complying with the police instructing him to get into the back seat of their vehicle. Now all that being said, from the videos it does appear excessive force was used by placing the knee on his neck. Whether sufficient pressure was applied by the knee to strangle him will come out in the autopsies. All of the actual facts will come out in a trial, hopefully. Until then I am keeping an open mind.

[ColdNoMore]

And the feeble attempts to try and mitigate, what we all saw with our own eyes...continues.


Given that, just imagine if there was no video (which happens in so many other similar cases)...of this murder.

[Stu from NYC]

Interesting to see what final autopsy report says and the results of the investigation.