[Hancle704]

Someone once told me that if you get proper rest, eat healthy , exercise regularly, don't smoke or drink alcoholic beverages, you will get to spend and extra 3 months living in a nursing home.

[Halibut]

Basically, then, Bush did everything right but still ended up with some level of coronary heart disease. So of course it's his fault and he should have done more. Or done something different. Or not done a third thing. Bah.

I had an "abnormal" stress test last year and let myself be bullied into a cardiac catheterization, which showed no blockages or narrowing at all. So, (1) the stress test was wrong, and (2) I'm 72 and a carnivore with no heart disease. My cholesterol is high and I don't much care and refuse to take drugs because of it.

There are no absolutes. Thin people develop Type 2 diabetes. Fit people have heart attacks. Not all smokers get lung cancer.

[Barefoot]

Originally Posted by Villages PL

Those are anecdotes. The science of health is not a hard science like math. In math there's usually only one right answer (2+2=4). There's no exception to that. But health is much more difficult because there are always exceptions. However, exceptions don't make the rule. The rule is made by what happens to most people when they do XYZ. For example, overweight people are at higher risk for getting certain diseases like diabetes. And that's determined by doing large long-term studies.

It seems that the analysis, the statistics, the rules and the links can all be picked to support whatever point of view is being advanced by each poster.

[chachacha]

the point about carnivorous octogenarians is true but the disturbing thing for us now is that they have not spent as many years eating beef which is full of hormones and anti-biotics as the younger people have been exposed to. that is the only reason i am avoiding so much red meat. not on any religious or philosophical grounds, just protecting myself from the as yet unknown risks of these engineered foods, including some veggies! everything in moderation is a common sense lifestyle to me.

[jimbo2012]

Originally Posted by manaboutown

Let's look at Warren Buffet. At his favorite restaurant in Omaha he has never been known to eat a green vegetable. He is in his eighties and seems to be doing fine on hamburgers, steaks and cherry coke.

Yep if you don't consider prostate cancer a problem.

[Villages PL]

Originally Posted by Barefoot

It seems that the analysis, the statistics, the rules and the links can all be picked to support whatever point of view is being advanced by each poster.

What is your point of view and what reliable source do you have to support it?

Note: There's no law against the dairy industry, beef industry, or fast food industry posting information on the internet through third parties. For example, they could hire a doctor, dietition or whomever to set up a website to provide favorable information about their products. And once it's posted it's considered by some to be an "objective point of view."

[Villages PL]

Originally Posted by chachacha

the point about carnivorous octogenarians is true but the disturbing thing for us now is that they have not spent as many years eating beef which is full of hormones and anti-biotics as the younger people have been exposed to. that is the only reason i am avoiding so much red meat. not on any religious or philosophical grounds, just protecting myself from the as yet unknown risks of these engineered foods, including some veggies! everything in moderation is a common sense lifestyle to me.

Good thought but why not take it one step further: Octogenarians were also not exposed to nearly as much fast food as we are today. When they were growing up, there were no fast food restaurants or supermarkets. And during the "lean" years they most likely stuck to basics. Most people were not that well off back then.

There were many immigrants from Europe who were not in the habit of eating red meat and many of them kept the same eating habits throughout their lives. Plus the fact that they walked more and worked harder. Today, lifestyles have changed drastically but many people think they are entitled to live as long as their grandparents because of their genetic inheritance.

I searched "Red Meat" and here's what I found: (If you scroll down you will see the many health issues resulting from red meat consumption.)

Red meat - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[Duvalboomer]

Originally Posted by Villages PL

You mentioned food, genetics, environment, stress and exercise. Unless you can come up with another one, I don't think the list goes "on and on". You can put genetics aside because genes only cause a very small fraction of disease. Degenerative diseases are caused mainly by lifestyle. So that leaves food, environment, stress and exercise.

This thread is about Bush so I would combine environment and stress together. He lived in a stressful environment. His father was president and he himself ran for office several times. This is typical of a type A personality (driven, hard-charging, aggressive). That's what it takes to get to the top.

As far as food, we know he once had a drinking problem. And we know, as a Texan, he was/is a big barbecue guy. That's a no brainer.

That leaves exercise. Didn't the opening post state that he was in three 62 mile bicycle rides? We know he's very competitive. There again we see his type A personality. He's an overachiever and overdoes everything. He takes a pleasurable sport and turns it into stress. Chronic stress leads to elevated stress hormones (cortisol). Higher levels of cortisol leads to insulin resistance and higher levels of insulin (hyperinsulinemia). That, along with poor diet, is how heart disease comes about.

I think it's a pretty good educated guess based on what I know about him.

I can come up with more for example accident such as in penetrating trauma and the list goes on from there. Stop deflecting, the OP ask if Bush should now consider a diet like Clinton's and my point is it's not that simple. For example how does anyone on this forum know what caused the blockage? maybe it was a combination of all of the factors, maybe it was pesticides in the vegetables he eats? maybe it was trauma caused a few years back when he almost chocked to death on a pretzel he was eating? I don't know and nether does the OP or you!

[Parker]

I don't believe George Bush likes broccoli anyway.

[perrjojo]

Should Bush change his diet? If he wants to.

[jimbo2012]

Originally Posted by AutoBike

I don't know one 90 year old vegan, but I knew/know several 90+ year old omnivores.

That's because they look like they're 75, U didn't realize it.

[Barefoot]

Originally Posted by AutoBike

Remember Euell Gibbons, the guy that promoted a diet of wild plants and berries? He died at age 64. He died from a ruptured aortic aneurysm. I always suspected a pine needle pierced his heart.

It's dangerous out there, when you have to forage for food on the floor of the forest every morning. Maybe he died of boredom from eating pine bark.

[senior citizen]

Originally Posted by Hancle704

Someone once told me that if you get proper rest, eat healthy , exercise regularly, don't smoke or drink alcoholic beverages, you will get to spend and extra 3 months living in a nursing home.

Yes.....to all of the above.....

..........or worse yet, die at age 60 from terminal lung cancer that spread to the brain and elsewhere after vigorous chemo and the best of surgery at Mount Sinai Hospital and also treatment at Sloan Kettering In New York City.....

Non smoking male. Avid competitive cyclist, cycled all over the world.
Ate a rigid vegetarian diet. Bone thin to the extreme. Successful businessman and owner of a large modern manufacturing plant; college grad. Engineer. Did everything right as far as his health was concerned but still suffered for years before dying at age 60. Entire family is bone thin; the daughter is a vegan; the wife a vegetarian (she has had years of cancer as well, but still alive).

All of that exercise and deprivation didn't help this guy at all.
He also played tennis and other sports........but cycling was his thing.

I do realize this thread began re heart disease, but this friend's lung cancer (even with all the best surgery and treatment), eventually somehow "wrapped around his heart muscle" according to what his wife told me.....

Sometimes I wonder if all the "fumes" he might have breathed in while cycling competitively and for pleasure..........didn't contribute to his lung cancer as he never smoked. So much for eating healthy when the environment might have played a role.

When I've mentioned this before, someone keeps calling it an "anecdote" when it is the God's honest truth.

People who fear death are the ones who constantly weigh every morsel of food that passes their lips rather than just enjoy the life that God gave them for however long that is.........

http://www.laurelofleaves.com/2012/0...s-not-healthy/
This young woman obviously has not lived as long as many of us........
Yet, she still has something worthwhile to say, explaining why she thinks a vegan diet is not healthy.
It's a long blog....so please keep scrolling down.....

[CFrance]

Originally Posted by AutoBike

Remember Euell Gibbons, the guy that promoted a diet of wild plants and berries? He died at age 64. He died from a ruptured aortic aneurysm. I always suspected a pine needle pierced his heart.

Originally Posted by Barefoot

It's dangerous out there, when you have to forage for food on the floor of the forest every morning. Maybe he died of boredom from eating pine bark.

He could have had pine mulch for free from my front yard.

[graciegirl]

Originally Posted by CFrance

He could have had pine mulch for free from my front yard.

Uhl Gibbons. Isn't he the fella that said that even elevator cable was edible?