[shcisamax]

Bravo Senior Citizen. Well said. I think you are on to something. Maybe serve yoghurt with the kale?

[eweissenbach]

Originally Posted by senior citizen

Sounds yummy.

Apparently, he or she is quite self controlled to the point of rigidity and never had or doesn't have a family to share his mealtimes with, nor does he have to cook for or entertain family members. Not everyone wants to eat the type of food plan he proclaims to strictly adhere to.

On another post he or she claimed that "treats" were wrong???
Obviously he has never had children nor grandchildren nor neighborhood children who do enjoy ice cream cones and cookies in addition to their fruits and veggies.

What a joyless existence to live strictly on carrots and kale. The yoghurt would add a creamy texture for sure.

It seems to me we need an Opt In food and nutrition board like the politics board. Some people have strong opinions on food and nutrition and health and seem almost as judgemental and condescending as some of the wing-nuts on the poli board. My opinion is that obesity is very bad and a problem in this country, but there are millions of people who eat a varied diet and are not obese, and many are very healthy. My opinion is also that genetics are the most important predictors of a long and healthy life. I love my beef and I also love chicken and fish and veggies - in other words - I love food. I am not obese and am relatively healthey, but don't intend to go to any extremes with my diet to insure a long life. Time will tell whether I live a long and healthy life and whether those living the vegan lifestyle will outlive me. However, whatever happens, I have enjoyed the time I've had and intend to continue. Everyone has to live their life and let others live theirs - this is no dress rehersal. Be happy! Ed

[Barefoot]

Originally Posted by Villages PL

Are we supposed to base our judgements on commercials and anecdotes?

Why not base judgments on radio shows or anecdotes or Dr. Oz? You seem to base your judgements by picking and choosing which studies to believe.
And it seems that every day a study is released that claims previous studies have been wrong.

Re yoghurt, doesn't it have probiotics which are beneficial to digestion?

[senior citizen]

Originally Posted by eweissenbach

It seems to me we need an Opt In food and nutrition board like the politics board. Some people have strong opinions on food and nutrition and health and seem almost as judgemental and condescending as some of the wing-nuts on the poli board. My opinion is that obesity is very bad and a problem in this country, but there are millions of people who eat a varied diet and are not obese, and many are very healthy. My opinion is also that genetics are the most important predictors of a long and healthy life. I love my beef and I also love chicken and fish and veggies - in other words - I love food. I am not obese and am relatively healthey, but don't intend to go to any extremes with my diet to insure a long life. Time will tell whether I live a long and healthy life and whether those living the vegan lifestyle will outlive me. However, whatever happens, I have enjoyed the time I've had and intend to continue. Everyone has to live their life and let others live theirs - this is no dress rehersal. Be happy! Ed

Great post. You'd be a pleasure to cook for.

I've always accomodated various palates and food preferences over the years, however, never have I read of someone so judgemental of everyone else's viewpoints of moderation.........we all know at our age what we shouldn't eat and what would be healthier. We do not need preaching from a soapbox.

For those who do favor this monastic type diet, great. They must feel they are doing something worthwhile for their own bodies.......but they really shouldn't expect everyone else to take up the Ezekial bread and the legumes to the exclusion of a Thanksgiving turkey !!!

I've mentioned in the past that I was raised on what is now called the "Mediteranean Diet" which is heavy on all types of beans, lentils, legumes, DARK GREENS, and small amounts of meat, seafood, etc. and home made pasta / macaroni. Meat was more for flavoring in those days......not huge hunks. They also ate cheese.

My Italian family was very long lived........and they drank red wine every day, which I probably should as well, but do not.

They ate fruit every day. That was the desert of choice. They PUT NO BUTTER on their peasant bread. Try to find good bread today. Near impossible.

The olive oil didn't hurt them any. People in those days were NOT on pharmaceuticals like folks today are.....with a pill for every part of their body.

Again, live and let live.

[Barefoot]

Originally Posted by Villages PL

Most people, obviously, will choose "moderation" which is another word for cheating. :-)

Really? The dictionary defines moderation as "the process of eliminating extremes". It doesn't say anything about cheating.

And I just deleted the rest of my post. Least said, soonest mended.

[Villages PL]

Originally Posted by senior citizen

.... how can you say her bone health is poor? Just wondering.

Go back and read my post. Did I say her bone health is poor?

You have a bad habit of taking everything someone says and picking it apart..........or else taking it out of context. I was NOT referring to any commercials at all, but to something I'd read doing my genealogy research.

Show me where I took anything out of context. I was simply telling you that an anecdote does not prove anything. And neither does your genealogy research.

For your information, most people do eat yoghurt daily nowadays, including the little ones.

That doesn't prove anything either. This thread is not about what most people do.

Although I do know people who are vegans and vegetarians, most people eat a diet of moderation and partake of a wide variety of foods.

Again it's not about what most people do.

It would be totally joyless to invite folks over for a big pot of KALE.

It's not about joy or lack of joy although I realize you want it to be about that.

[Moderator]

Please address the topic and not each other. Everyone is entitled to express their opinion. There is no expectation of universal agreement but differences of opinion can be addressed respectfully.

Moderator

[Villages PL]

Originally Posted by eweissenbach

It seems to me we need an Opt In food and nutrition board like the politics board. Some people have strong opinions on food and nutrition and health and seem almost as judgemental and condescending as some of the wing-nuts on the poli board. My opinion is that obesity is very bad and a problem in this country, but there are millions of people who eat a varied diet and are not obese, and many are very healthy. My opinion is also that genetics are the most important predictors of a long and healthy life. I love my beef and I also love chicken and fish and veggies - in other words - I love food. I am not obese and am relatively healthey, but don't intend to go to any extremes with my diet to insure a long life. Time will tell whether I live a long and healthy life and whether those living the vegan lifestyle will outlive me. However, whatever happens, I have enjoyed the time I've had and intend to continue. Everyone has to live their life and let others live theirs - this is no dress rehersal. Be happy! Ed

Ed,

It's not about being judgemental and condescending, it's about science. My main point, in general, that I have been trying to make, is that you can't get to a balanced diet by eating unbalanced processed foods.

If someone wants to say that they don't care, that's fine. But then I wonder what they're doing on this thread. I mean what's the point? They're not telling me I'm wrong, they're just making the case that they don't like the balance that comes from natural whole foods. They want their processed foods. So they're not interested in balance as much as they are interested in maintaning the status quo. And the status quo is that we have a high percentage of overweight people in the U.S.(that includes The Villages). Not to mention high rates of degenerative diseases.

[Villages PL]

Originally Posted by Barefoot

Really? The dictionary defines moderation as "the process of eliminating extremes". It doesn't say anything about cheating.

And I just deleted the rest of my post. Least said, soonest mended.

I wasn't giving a dictionary definition. According to your definition of "eliminating extremes", it would be entirely subjective, wouldn't it? So invoking the term or idea of "moderation" is not helpful in this discussion. Everyone has a different idea of what is extreme and many here think that eating a healthy diet, as I do, is extreme.

My point, again, is that one cannot get to a balanced diet by eating unbalanced processed foods.

[Villages PL]

Originally Posted by Barefoot

Why not base judgments on radio shows or anecdotes or Dr. Oz? You seem to base your judgements by picking and choosing which studies to believe.
And it seems that every day a study is released that claims previous studies have been wrong.

No study that I know of has yet proved that natural whole foods are bad, like fresh fruit, non-starchy vegetables, legumes, berries, nuts and whole grains. This is something that all health experts agree on. (Of course it assumes there is no disease involved. If someone is ill they may not be able to eat normally.

[jimbo2012]

Originally Posted by Villages PL

If someone wants to say that they don't care, that's fine. But then I wonder what they're doing on this thread. I mean what's the point? They're not telling me I'm wrong, they're just making the case that they don't like the balance that comes from natural whole foods. They want their processed foods. So they're not interested in balance as much as they are interested in maintaning the status quo. And the status quo is that we have a high percentage of overweight people in the U.S.(that includes The Villages). Not to mention high rates of degenerative diseases.

I think that several of us advocating eating better are hitting a nerve in some, they know it makes sense but may feel threatened by reading that the way and what they eat is just simply not good. So they defend how they eat bad and it doesn't matter...........

So they still read the info posted.

What's most rewarding for me is the fact that I'm getting PM's every few days asking serious questions and tell me their glad that this issue as been raised and made them aware of the problems eating badly.

In the end it's their choice, it's strange but I see more resistance here to living healthier and longer than the retirement village I was at this past winter.

Many retirees are resigned to the fact that they are aging and it's normal to gain weight, take meds to offset the abnormal test results.
let's be honest to change your eating habits after 50+ years isn't as easy for some without strong will power as others with less will power. Just like some quit smoking easier than others.

I know that if anyone tried it for 30 days they will feel a new awaking in many many ways.

There after it's easy to stay on a plant based diet.

I have introduced perhaps 75+ people in the past year that I know of about 1/3 are sticking with it.

Off soap box!!!!

[shcisamax]

What a bunch of hogwash. No one is threatened and no one is defending eating poorly. They are defending what balance in their life means. Healthy food is just one piece that goes into living a healthy life. I don't think anyone has an issue with looking at new information and trying new things EXCEPT those who are extremists. What people have an issue with is a condescending and arrogant demeanor. No one likes to be talked down too. I frankly think this thread should go the way of file 13 since I am pretty sure it was started by someone who wanted to cause dissension. It has gotten quite ugly and pointless. Everyone is entitled to their opinion and it is time to leave it at that. End of report.

[eweissenbach]

I wish everyone good luck with their health and their diet. I have not been influenced to change anything I do re: diet and nutrition, in any way by this thread. If you are happy with your diet, health, and nutrition - bon appetit. I am going to enjoy a steak, baked potato and salad now that I have had a nice cocktail.

[skyc6]

Originally Posted by villages pl

senior citizen,

everything you said about red wine, such as antioxidants and polyphenols, is true of richly colored unrefined vegetables, fresh fruits, legumes and whole grains.

and red wine!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[skyc6]

I would agree with Shcisamax that it seems that this thread, and other comparable threads, are not so much a discussion or sharing of ideas, but seem to be more a lecture series given by a few. There does not seem to be any room to consider another's viewpoint, and a very narrow margin of what is acceptable or not. IMHO this rigid, almost desparate need to live such a starkly controlled existence results in just that...a very starkly controlled existence. When someone expresses an appreciation for the joyful sharing of food with loved ones, even involving an occasional treat, they are almost reprimanded. It was suggested that to enjoy an occasional treat implied a lack of understanding! Really??? I think a lack of social interaction and joy in living can be just as "unbalanced" as the occasional treat.