[Michael 61]

Even if the kitchen is to blame for slow service, I still hold the server accountable for lack of communication - most people are understanding of delays, as long as it is being communicated to them (which is the job of the server).

[Pairadocs]

Originally Posted by Kenswing

That’s unfortunate. We’ve dined at Harvest four times and have had great service and food each time. That’s why we keep going back. I wonder if they’re short handed because of the holidays.

Could be short staffed due to time of year, but also "stuff" just happens, as they say. Today was in Ocala to do some errands, as always, had to make a lunch stop at one of our favs, Harry's on the square. Was seated in 10 min., drinks and hot bread arrived, nearly as soon as we ordered, but..... then, over 1 hour passed, was just baffled, but had a patio table on a beautiful day, drinks and delicious bread and time just passed. He was always checking to see if we needed more hot bread or more drinks.... but finally realized we had to get on with it and told the waiter. He came back and instead of giving us a line about the kitchen, cooks, etc. etc. he was completely honest ! He came back and said he could not apologize enough, that HE was responsible for our ticket not getting onto the line. It was so obvious he was sincere. We told him everyone makes mistakes sometimes, and only asked him to see if he could get it soon (Which he did, and again was sincerely apologetic). We had observed him and he was certainly personable, attentive, and seemed very efficient and knowledgeable ... We didn't complain and yes, left him 20%. Not that we want to support poor 1service, but sometimes an individual who clearly is experienced and knows his or her job, can still make a mistake ! ! Now, had we observed him ignoring his tables, "playing" on his cell phone, spending most of his time conversing with other servers, etc., that would be an entirely different outcome. Hey, it's the season to be gracious ! Oh, and the French Market pasta...with shrimp and chicken, was superb ! !

[westernrider75]

Originally Posted by npwalters

There are many people in TV that are willing to accept poor service and just write it off as staff shortage or large crowds due to high season. Personally, I tip well for good, or even reasonable service, and not at all for bad service.

To all you people who believe that leaving a small or no tip because you had an unsatisfactory experience, you’ve apparently never worked in a restaurant. You want to blame the server because that is your direct contact. The vast majority of problems are not within the servers control. That server can only control so much and their wages depend on you like it or not. Spend some time in their shoes and you might not be so quick to penalize them for things out of their control.

[oldtimes]

Originally Posted by westernrider75

To all you people who believe that leaving a small or no tip because you had an unsatisfactory experience, you’ve apparently never worked in a restaurant. You want to blame the server because that is your direct contact. The vast majority of problems are not within the servers control. That server can only control so much and their wages depend on you like it or not. Spend some time in their shoes and you might not be so quick to penalize them for things out of their control.

There is absolutely no empathy around here. On this forum we only hear one side to every story and people are too quick to jump to a conclusion from that.

[asianthree]

Short staffed or not, first rule of any experienced waitstaff, stop at table, intro yourself, get drink order. Less than a minute. If management is on top of things, they will make sure their restaurant is running smoothly, under staffed or not.

Even if you have 10 tables, most customers will be sympathetic, with your efforts. Not going to a table for more than 10 minutes is just lack of experience, on that waitstaff. Key word is “experience”, which is a big problem in any retail situation.

[mazbarth]

Hi Michael, you "look" like another native Northern Californian? Me too! 🙂
Born SF, raised in Napa Valley!

[ThirdOfFive]

Wow! Enough stuff here for at least three discussions.

Regarding service quality though, for the most part it appears to be independent of the price of the food. One of the best restaurants week in and week out, insofar as service quality goes, is Amerikanos. We've eaten there dozens of times and have NEVER had bad service. Our favorite waitperson is Hayley, a pint-sized sparkplug of a gal who moves like a 33 1/3 record played at 78 (I'm confident most of the readers here know what that means). Nobody would ever confuse Amerikanos as "fine dining" (one step up, more or less, from Culver's insofar as price goes), but their service puts that of several other much higher priced restaurants to shame.

A bit higher up on the price scale is Lopez Legacy. There again, we've never had bad service. Waitstaff impeccably dressed, knowledgeable, and honest. Like what was mentioned in another post in this thread, the waitstaff will inform you if they're out of something before you even order. They'll also suggest alternatives. Even when the place is packed, we've never had to wait an excessive amount of time for service, or for our meal once ordered.

Okay. Two restaurants at opposite ends of the price spectrum (and a whole lot of restaurants in between that don't measure up, service-wise). Meal cost at the one is multiples of the other, but the SERVICE is pretty much the same. Why? I have the advantage of accessing my wife's wisdom on this, who was a waitress to put herself through college. She also trained new waitstaff on just how to do it. The first thing she mentioned is that good waitstaff NEVER go anywhere empty-handed. If they see a table needing to be bussed and the person responsible for that is overloaded with dirty tables, they'll pitch in and help. Or, if they see a coffee cup needing to be refilled and they're passing a table where a coffee cup needs to be refilled, even if it is not a table in their section, they'll ask the customer if they'd like more coffee (or water, or whatever) they'll offer a refill. They work as part of a team and as a result the whole place runs more smoothly. This does seem to be the case most of the time at Amerikanos.

1st. criterion: Training.

My wife knows people associated with Lopez Legacy. According to her, the waitstaff over there, probably contrary to most other restaurants in TV, receive benefits such as health insurance, vacation pay, etc. (this is word-of-mouth, not verified). But it stands to reason. If your employer invests in you, you're more apt to hang around and reap the benefits than if you're recruited after a cursory interview, given a few hours of basic training and tossed out onto the floor to earn your minimum wage.

2nd criterion: Motivation.

These are just my observations but they seem to hold up. Just how many restaurants in TV make it a point to thoroughly train and motivate their waitstaff is anyone's guess, but in our experience the number that don't is far greater than the number that do.

Oh--one more thing. If we like a restaurant, we'll make sure we're remembered. Be friendly, ask the waitstaffs' names, engage them in conversation, and leave a tip large enough to be remembered. Sort of like buying insurance. It helps. Sure, there are those who will balk at this, claiming that service should be independent of stuff like that, but this is the real world and people are people. If you make a positive investment in something, odds are that you will get a good return.

[JMintzer]

Originally Posted by OrangeBlossomBaby

It's even more nefarious than that. I've worked as a waitress in a few full-service restaurants, and at a summer resort.

Here's what happens when people over-tip:

The management/owner sees the receipts. Credit card tips are monitored. If they see a trend of high percentage tips, it justifies them paying their employees sub-minimum wage - which is LEGAL. How it works in Florida:

Minimum wage is $11/hour in Florida. Except for servers. For them, it's $7.98/hour. Let's round that up to an even $8/hour. That's $3 less per hour than other hourly workers in the state.

So let's say the server is getting an average of $2 per table in tips - and they have 4 tables per hour, for four hours. That's $32 per shift in tips. It also means their ACTUAL hourly pay averages the $8/hour server minimum, plus $8/hour in tips = $16/hour. Since that's $5/hour more than the NON-server minimum wage, the employer can justify never paying their employees better than that server wage of $8/hour.

The more they earn, the more justified the employer is in never giving their servers a raise. That means - employees working slower shifts where they might not see more than $5 in an entire shift (like Monday opening shift at some places), will always earn less than the $11/hour non-server wage.

If everyone tipped according to the old-school "standard" employers would likely pay their servers more to begin with, because they won't assume customers will help their servers "make bank" in tips. This hurts new employees who just aren't trained well enough yet, or have enough experience yet, to hustle for those extra bucks. And that causes a lot of turnover, which puts more pressure on the seasoned employees to pick up the slack, which causes burnout, which causes turnover.

As someone who has worked in the service-for-tip industry, I tip how I was taught to expect being tipped:

15% for just doing my job, nothing more or less.
18% for doing my job well, and demonstrating efficient problem-solving skills.
20% for going above and beyond the job description.
0% if I did something actually BAD enough to get management involved.

What you worked, decades ago, has no bearing on today.

Pretty much everything you posted is incorrect.

Yes, they start the employees at below "minimum wage", but it they don't collect enough tips to reach the "$11.00/hr", the employer MUST pay them the difference.

They are guaranteed that amount, per state law...

The non-servers (if they are non tipped) do not fall into that category and MUST be paid the $11/hr. If they are part of the tip pool, they STILL are guaranteed the $11/hr per state law...

[Ele201]

Originally Posted by OrangeBlossomBaby

It's even more nefarious than that. I've worked as a waitress in a few full-service restaurants, and at a summer resort.

Here's what happens when people over-tip:

The management/owner sees the receipts. Credit card tips are monitored. If they see a trend of high percentage tips, it justifies them paying their employees sub-minimum wage - which is LEGAL. How it works in Florida:

Minimum wage is $11/hour in Florida. Except for servers. For them, it's $7.98/hour. Let's round that up to an even $8/hour. That's $3 less per hour than other hourly workers in the state.

So let's say the server is getting an average of $2 per table in tips - and they have 4 tables per hour, for four hours. That's $32 per shift in tips. It also means their ACTUAL hourly pay averages the $8/hour server minimum, plus $8/hour in tips = $16/hour. Since that's $5/hour more than the NON-server minimum wage, the employer can justify never paying their employees better than that server wage of $8/hour.

The more they earn, the more justified the employer is in never giving their servers a raise. That means - employees working slower shifts where they might not see more than $5 in an entire shift (like Monday opening shift at some places), will always earn less than the $11/hour non-server wage.

If everyone tipped according to the old-school "standard" employers would likely pay their servers more to begin with, because they won't assume customers will help their servers "make bank" in tips. This hurts new employees who just aren't trained well enough yet, or have enough experience yet, to hustle for those extra bucks. And that causes a lot of turnover, which puts more pressure on the seasoned employees to pick up the slack, which causes burnout, which causes turnover.

As someone who has worked in the service-for-tip industry, I tip how I was taught to expect being tipped:

15% for just doing my job, nothing more or less.
18% for doing my job well, and demonstrating efficient problem-solving skills.
20% for going above and beyond the job description.
0% if I did something actually BAD enough to get management involved.

Respectfully I think these percentages are a bit low. I give 20% for good service, always. Above and beyond, 25%. I’ve never called a manager on a server.

[ThirdOfFive]

Originally Posted by Ele201

Respectfully I think these percentages are a bit low. I give 20% for good service, always. Above and beyond, 25%. I’ve never called a manager on a server.

I have.

If service is truly reprehensible (once had a waitress who actually picked her nose while taking our order) I'll tell the manager. Very rare happenstance that I'd ever do that, by the way.

But...I'll also inform the manager if service is above and beyond. Apparently most people don't do that. I remember eating at Red Lobster in Burnsville, MN some years back. Place was packed, but our waitress was on top of her game. Other than the fact that our food was a bit slow in coming, no complaints.

At the end of our meal I asked the waitress if I could talk to the manager. You could see her tense up, but she fetched the manager, who looked equally tense. When the manager arrived I told him that this particular waitress was excellent at her job and was a credit to the restaurant. She lit up like a Christmas tree, and got a BIG smile from the manager as well.

It is a two-way street. Easy to criticize, but be ready to compliment as well.

[charlieo1126@gmail.com]

My favorites in Brownwood are in order Blue Fin, Prima and Harvest all 3 are terrific and the service has been mostly good , I would give it another try , sometimes things happen just like in life .

[williep]

It sounds like The Stockholm Syndrome!

[fdpaq0580]

Originally Posted by westernrider75

To all you people who believe that leaving a small or no tip because you had an unsatisfactory experience, you’ve apparently never worked in a restaurant. You want to blame the server because that is your direct contact. The vast majority of problems are not within the servers control. That server can only control so much and their wages depend on you like it or not. Spend some time in their shoes and you might not be so quick to penalize them for things out of their control.

Never worked in a restaurant. (By choice). Server is often the only contact, unless you call the manager. Server can relay satifaction or dissatisfaction to the appropriate person if necessary. But, customers are not responsible for the servers wages! Tips are not "required", whether you like it or not. The management is responsible for insuring the servers receive minimum wage, tips or no tips.

[Emkay56]

We had a similar experience on my birthday, which also happened to be Thanksgiving, but it was at Red Sauce. The food was mediocre, even though the menu looked outstanding for that day and we were really looking forward to it. Our server was not friendly at all and was very slow in taking care of our requests. Needless to say, I don’t know if I’d ever go back there even though others have told us how great the food is.

Originally Posted by HawkinsGuy

Just spent 2-hours “dining” at Harvest Restaurant in Brownwood. Was only approached after about 20 minutes. Between the time the appetizer and dinner order was taken and served, it was at least 45 minutes, maybe longer. While that is perfectly acceptable at a Michelin star restaurant, I suggest it represents abysmal service at Harvest. To top it off, the blond woman at the front desk was rather rude when I CALMLY mentioned the issue and her asking curtly “what do you want?” Duh, how about reasonable service! I should mention they were kind enough to comp a desert for my family. Notwithstanding the fiasco, I did leave a 30% tip since I understand that wait staff relies on tips. I suggest this was a management issue so why penalize the server. As for me, thanks for ruining my birthday dinner. I wont return to Harvest anytime soon and my recommendation to others is to think before you visit Harvest. Your mileage may vary.

[charlieo1126@gmail.com]

Originally Posted by OrangeBlossomBaby

It's even more nefarious than that. I've worked as a waitress in a few full-service restaurants, and at a summer resort.

Here's what happens when people over-tip:

The management/owner sees the receipts. Credit card tips are monitored. If they see a trend of high percentage tips, it justifies them paying their employees sub-minimum wage - which is LEGAL. How it works in Florida:

Minimum wage is $11/hour in Florida. Except for servers. For them, it's $7.98/hour. Let's round that up to an even $8/hour. That's $3 less per hour than other hourly workers in the state.

So let's say the server is getting an average of $2 per table in tips - and they have 4 tables per hour, for four hours. That's $32 per shift in tips. It also means their ACTUAL hourly pay averages the $8/hour server minimum, plus $8/hour in tips = $16/hour. Since that's $5/hour more than the NON-server minimum wage, the employer can justify never paying their employees better than that server wage of $8/hour.

The more they earn, the more justified the employer is in never giving their servers a raise. That means - employees working slower shifts where they might not see more than $5 in an entire shift (like Monday opening shift at some places), will always earn less than the $11/hour non-server wage.

If everyone tipped according to the old-school "standard" employers would likely pay their servers more to begin with, because they won't assume customers will help their servers "make bank" in tips. This hurts new employees who just aren't trained well enough yet, or have enough experience yet, to hustle for those extra bucks. And that causes a lot of turnover, which puts more pressure on the seasoned employees to pick up the slack, which causes burnout, which causes turnover.

As someone who has worked in the service-for-tip industry, I tip how I was taught to expect being tipped:

15% for just doing my job, nothing more or less.
18% for doing my job well, and demonstrating efficient problem-solving skills.
20% for going above and beyond the job description.
0% if I did something actually BAD enough to get management involved.

I over tip I’m not going to say how much because I wouldn’t be believed , but my tips are always in cash and while I don’t ask I’m sure the wait staff put the extra in there pocket , I also give money at Christmas to favorite servers , I eat out all the time and never cook , I see how hard the job is and could tell you more stories then you have time to listen about how many people stiff the servers when it comes to tips in the villages and the many managers who move there hours around on a whim , these problems are not unique just to villages , but far worse then any other place I’ve been