[wendyquat]

Originally Posted by buggyone

Well, from all the negative feelings about The Villages, it looks as though the real estate agents will be having a field day in getting new listings.

Maybe Buggy, but maybe not so anxious buyers!

[Steve9930]

Originally Posted by njbchbum

where can an lsv cross other than up at spruce creek south? and you surely don't mean that anything other than street legals can cross, do you?

LSV (Street Legal) can cross at the light next to the two banks coming out of the Lowes parking lot. You can cross there at the Hospital and Doctors offices. You basically can cross anywhere there on 441/27. Golf carts are not considered LSVs. They cannot cross legally.

[Peachie]

Originally Posted by Steve9930

Anyone can use all the cart paths today, even with the new wall. You can cross 441/27 with a LSV and use the cart paths. Or you can go rent a golf cart for a small fee and run around all day long. Don't even need to be a senior. The number of carts that come from Stonecrest or Spruce Creek South is really small in number. The majority of this inconvenience is on the shoulders of those that live in the Historic Section and the Spanish Springs area.

I would agree that there are not many LSV's from outside communities using our paths now but what evidence do you have that very few carts come into The Villages from Stonecrest?

There was a post on here just a bit ago from a gal, Donna, in Stonecrest telling how up-in-arms people there are about the news of the wall being installed by The Villages to which Graciegirl responded that there were previous threads regarding the matter.

I believe the majority of the inconvenience is on the shoulders of the people in Stonecrest, am I wrong... EdV? I understand EdV's, (who is working very hard to keep this accessible for Stonecrest), efforts to keep access to The Villages open for Stonecresters, but my investment is in The Villages and I don't want the increase in cart traffic that a nice paved path straight into The Villages paths will create.

There was a very, very serious bike vs cart accident on one of The Villages golf cart paths a short time ago. The accident was the fault of the cart driver who was from Oxford, not The Villages and did not belong on these paths. Would this have happened in gated Stonecrest?

[villages07]

Originally Posted by skip0358

I'm not sticking up for anyone. Maybe the Moorse Family didn't put the wall up, so IF he didn't put it up he can't take it down or comment on it. Why don't you try and contact Gary Lester he seems to be the go to guy !!

Skip... this is the first mention of Lester... was surprised that it had not come up before.

Dr Gary Lester, VP of Community Relations for The Villages... the main PR guy. If ever there was a need for a PR man...they need one now.

BK... anyone been in contact with Lester?

I have been a long time supporter of the developer for the wonderful community he has built and the rewards he has reaped for the risks he took. I believed in the 'benevolent dictatorship' since things have always run smoothly and kept getting better. Not so sure about the benevolent part now. Either he didn't know how many people would be impacted or just didn't care. If the latter, that's just sad. If the former, a good PR man can smooth things over and return the path to operation.

Whether it was a business/liability decision or just a feud with a rival landowner, an explanation before taking action would have headed off most of this controversy.

For the record, I live south of LSL but we both have doctors in the medical plaza adjacent to TV and on the other side of Lowes and probably used the "hole in the wall" 10-15 times a year. With 1 car, 2 carts this will be an inconvenience for us. For some folks, it is a game changer. We are all Villagers and should have empathy for those most directly affected.

I hope this is resolved quickly and things are restored back to what was with face saved all the way around.

Very poorly handled and might make the commissioners in Fruitland Park think twice about wanting to invite TV development into their city limits...they will have effectively ceded future control of their town to TV's developers.

I'm not too proud of Gary and Mark Morse right now.

[Steve9930]

Originally Posted by Dr Winston O Boogie jr

I think that if it does come to a court case a decent lawyer would be able to get an injunction against keeping the path open until the case is settled, seeing as how it has been open for 20 years.

Civil Court can be a nightmare with all kinds of legal maneuvers to frustrate even the most patient in life.

[bkcunningham1]

Originally Posted by villages07

Skip... this is the first mention of Lester... was surprised that it had not come up before.

Dr Gary Lester, VP of Community Relations for The Villages... the main PR guy. If ever there was a need for a PR man...they need one now.

BK... anyone been in contact with Lester?

I have been a long time supporter of the developer for the wonderful community he has built and the rewards he has reaped for the risks he took. I believed in the 'benevolent dictatorship' since things have always run smoothly and kept getting better. Not so sure about the benevolent part now. Either he didn't know how many people would be impacted or just didn't care. If the latter, that's just sad. If the former, a good PR man can smooth things over and return the path to operation.

Whether it was a business/liability decision or just a feud with a rival landowner, an explanation before taking action would have headed off most of this controversy.

For the record, I live south of LSL but we both have doctors in the medical plaza adjacent to TV and on the other side of Lowes and probably used the "hole in the wall" 10-15 times a year. With 1 car, 2 carts this will be an inconvenience for us. For some folks, it is a game changer. We are all Villagers and should have empathy for those most directly affected.

I hope this is resolved quickly and things are restored back to what was with face saved all the way around.

Very poorly handled and might make the commissioners in Fruitland Park think twice about wanting to invite TV development into their city limits...they will have effectively ceded future control of their town to TV's developers.

I'm not too proud of Gary and Mark Morse right now.

His office stopped taking calls on Monday afternoon and Tuesday. I don't know about today. I've been busy and didn't get a chance to call.

[Dr Winston O Boogie jr]

Originally Posted by PennBF

For you new people. This is still a great community but has some serious warts that must be removed. Hopefully all residence will remember this at election time as the ballot box is always the democratic way to get rid of these rascals. I was going to go into more discussion but it is probably useless and only voting the varmits out will fix these kind of problems. How many "elected" officials from the State Reps. down to the CDD members have you seen at the wall demanding action? You don't have to take your shoes off as you can probably count them on 1/2 a hand. Of course the POA President was there but you would not expect less from the POA..

I agree. It is a wonderful place to live and I wouldn't want to live anywhere else. I also think that the developer has done a wonderful job and has given us all an opportunity for a very nice lifestyle. He has been rewarded for that and so have the many employees and us residents.

I don't like what was done here and I'd like to see it either reversed or explained. But that is only one aspect of life here. There is so much good about the place.

[Dr Winston O Boogie jr]

Originally Posted by Steve9930

Civil Court can be a nightmare with all kinds of legal maneuvers to frustrate even the most patient in life.

That why they issue injunctions. By the way, I had a typo in my post and I fixed it. I meant an injunction keeping the path open until it is settled.

[JeffAVEWS]

Originally Posted by Peachie

Thinking about the long term effects of a decision to allow a paved path from outling communities into The Villages with their golf carts forever... might not hurt either. Maybe the developer is trying to save many of us from ourselves.

There is hard work at hand to open that "hole in the wall". If it is reopened, the big winners are Stonecrest, Spruce Creek and the developed areas beyond. It's not that difficult to have the county open up the back streets to allow access to "The Path". The home values in those subdivisions would profit nicely while The Villages would definitely lose value.

Remember the premium you paid when you bought in The Villages for the Lifestyle? Now many bordering communities have access to the same things we have and don't have to pay the piper. They also are private and much quieter with bigger lots for a lot less money.

If that gate is reopened and the path is paved into The Villages, I would advise anyone considering buying in The Villages to look at these surrounding communities. They would have a gated, private neighborhood with pools, golf and activity centers to enjoy and there is no longer anything special about The Villages. Anyone can use their cart paths.

There is a lot more to think about here, the long term ramifications are HUGE. You can't unring a bell.

Peachie, this is not "These are my toys and you can't play with them" We residents of the Historic side have been harmed by the construction of the Concrete Curtain We are the predominant users of the right-of-way, not Stonecrest or anyplace else. I'm sure the merchants doing business in SS are happy to have their business.

[Steve9930]

Originally Posted by Dr Winston O Boogie jr

That why they issue injunctions. By the way, I had a typo in my post and I fixed it. I meant an injunction keeping the path open until it is settled.

I knew what you meant. If the community would have known ahead of the actual closing then I agree, an injunction would have easily been issued to keep the path open until litigation was resolved. This is why I believe it was handled in the way it was handled. Now that the wall is up it works in the opposite direction. No judge will order the wall removed.

[Rob&Lu]

Originally Posted by bkcunningham1

His office stopped taking calls on Monday afternoon and Tuesday. I don't know about today. I've been busy and didn't get a chance to call.

As a 22year resident of The Villages, and a resident on Paradise Dr., it's pretty clear that this decision, especially given it's "stealthiness" has to do with something personal and probably petty.

When was the last time you saw the Morse family NOT trumpet some change to The Villages infrastructure? Their total silence and the refusal of Lester's office to even respond to this doesn't pass the smell test.

Years ago, the Morses wanted to make that cart passage a thru STREET, and we went up in arms about it, and so the cart path was modified, including the island (it used to have a gate pass system). The path only helps The Villages by bringing traffic into it at the Square, and by providing convenience to the medical building, doctors' offices, Urgent Care and other shopping areas NOT in competition with Villages businesses.

So what's left besides cutting off your nose to spite your face?

Hopefully the Morses will see the folly of their pettiness, and the loss of profit, and quietly and quickly reverse this horrible mis-calculation of public sentiment and restore good-will.

The Morses have built up too much good-will in our community by providing such a great place to live. Please don't make the memory of our dear Harold turn over in his grave over a petty argument!

[bkcunningham1]

Originally Posted by Rob&Lu

As a 22year resident of The Villages, and a resident on Paradise Dr., it's pretty clear that this decision, especially given it's "stealthiness" has to do with something personal and probably petty.

When was the last time you saw the Morse family NOT trumpet some change to The Villages infrastructure? Their total silence and the refusal of Lester's office to even respond to this doesn't pass the smell test.

Years ago, the Morses wanted to make that cart passage a thru STREET, and we went up in arms about it, and so the cart path was modified, including the island (it used to have a gate pass system). The path only helps The Villages by bringing traffic into it at the Square, and by providing convenience to the medical building, doctors' offices, Urgent Care and other shopping areas NOT in competition with Villages businesses.

So what's left besides cutting off your nose to spite your face?

Hopefully the Morses will see the folly of their pettiness, and the loss of profit, and quietly and quickly reverse this horrible mis-calculation of public sentiment and restore good-will.

The Morses have built up too much good-will in our community by providing such a great place to live. Please don't make the memory of our dear Harold turn over in his grave over a petty argument!

Welcome to Talk of the Villages. I am sorry that we are meeting under these circumstances but what a pleasure it is to read your wise and well thought out words. I hope you stick around. I have a feeling we can learn a lot from you.

[Russ_Boston]

I guess I'm missing something - please help me understand.

Nowhere else in TV does the developer 'invite' you to take a cart onto private property. There are signs everywhere that say "no carts past this point" or we have those brown fences which signal 'out of bounds' if you will. The fact that people did (not the developer) basically create a path for these many years that lead to 'off campus' facilities does not in any way mean it was meant to be that way forever.

Yes I can greatly sympathize with those that built their agenda around this access but there are many other examples around TV to look at:

When Sumter Place was built with 3 stories instead of 2 people bitched. Although Sumter Place is not owned by TV.

When lands that were once vacant or had buffalo on them were developed and neighbors lost their privacy in their backyards they bitched.

People along 466a that back up to the now occupied by cows farmland are bitching at the possible sale of that land that may lead to further homes in their current quiet back yards.

The point is you can only control what is known. If you buy a home next to current vacant land you may not have it that way forever. If you take a cart path on locations that they are not supposed to be on but do it anyway don't expect that condition to last forever.

I think it would be different if there was something in writing that granted easement to these properties but this is just something that developed over time and times change.

Go ahead and call me the bad guy if you wish. I have empathy for you and feel where you are coming from but...

[Peachie]

Originally Posted by JeffAVEWS

Peachie, this is not "These are my toys and you can't play with them" We residents of the Historic side have been harmed by the construction of the Concrete Curtain We are the predominant users of the right-of-way, not Stonecrest or anyplace else. I'm sure the merchants doing business in SS are happy to have their business.

Jeff, how about a grown-up rephrasing of your statement... This is my real estate and you can devalue it by rewriting the covenants we all agreed to when we paid extra for this lifestyle. As I said in an earlier statement on here... different people we have talked with over the years from the Historic section hoped that the path would never be closed off. It was a gamble that the covenants of an enclosed community wouldn't be enforced.

Funny thing is I brought up a discussion with my husband this past spring about considering Stonecrest. It has much lower traffic, lower home prices, private and gated, golf course availability and if access to The Villages is streamlined, the conversation will sure be worth revisiting.

[DougB]

Villagers were invited to use this path by the very fact it was allowed for 20 years. Yes, there are signs every where, but there was never a sign there.