[Bill14564]

Originally Posted by Maker

How can they crash?

Way #1
The 3:00 car enters the rab already moving. Trivial to reach 20mph. Car did yield (was not required to stop) since they are watching traffic, see just that one other car in the inside lane, and safely enter the rab not next to that car with spacing.
The inside car exits across the path of the 3:00 car.

The 3:00 car overtakes the car already in the RAB. DON'T DO THAT!

Way #2
Both cars traveling with a reasonable gap between them. Car on the inside lane slows down to make the exit "safer" by checking their mirrors. Then exits in front of outside lane car.

Why would someone slow down in the RAB? To check their mirrors? They are in a turn and might only see flowers.
Even so, the 3:00 car overtakes the car already in the RAB. DON'T DO THAT!

Way #3
Car in outside lane is not from the entitled TV population and is expecting a car in the inside lane to USE TURN SIGNALS, and they fail to do so.

If a driver on the road today expects anyone to use their turn signals or believes that anyone is going to follow their turn signals they need much more experience.

But in any case, the 3:00 car overtakes the car already in the RAB. DON'T DO THAT!

Way #4
There is a third car in the inside lane. First car exits rab, and the car in the outside lane brakes to avoid a collision. The car following the outside lane exits very close the back of the car braking because they expected that car to move at the same speed. Exiting car brakes to avoid hitting the rear of that breaking car. But there is a 4th car, it's in the outside lane. Reaction time kicks in and by the time they brake to avoid the mess ahead, that 3rd car exits, crashing into them.

Seems like all of that is following too closely and inattentive driving. DON'T DO THAT!

All cars are following all signs, all posted how-to-drive maps, all recommended "safe" advice from our keyboard experts.

BUT
If the outside lane must exit at every side road. (barriers prevent going around)
The only way to go around (pass a side road) is via the inside lane.
There would be none of this endless debates. Crashing at the rab exits would not be possible in any scenario because there would be no lane with vehicles to crash with.

As others have suggested, just merge two lanes of traffic to one through the RAB then expand back to two only to merge again at the next RAB. And some think we have traffic problems now!

These are examples of impossible physics, unsafe driving, inexperience, or some combination of the three. They may speak to the expected level of driving skills but none expose an inherent flaw of the RAB or signage.

We don't say that roads are unsafe because someone traveling 55mph might be hit by someone behind them traveling mph. Instead we say that the driver traveling 85mph was in the wrong.

We don't say that red lights are unsafe because rear-end crashes happen at signaled intersections. Instead we say that drivers need to pay more attention.

Unfortunately, we *do* take away flashing yellow turns because a crash has occurred when a driver did not look hard enough to see oncoming traffic. That was still the driver's fault and not a flaw with the intersection. But if we are going to cater to the least common denominator then we'll soon be back to someone carrying a light and walking in front of the horseless carriage.

[Randall55]

Originally Posted by Maker

How can they crash?

Way #1
The 3:00 car enters the rab already moving. Trivial to reach 20mph. Car did yield (was not required to stop) since they are watching traffic, see just that one other car in the inside lane, and safely enter the rab not next to that car with spacing.
The inside car exits across the path of the 3:00 car.

Way #2
Both cars traveling with a reasonable gap between them. Car on the inside lane slows down to make the exit "safer" by checking their mirrors. Then exits in front of outside lane car.

Way #3
Car in outside lane is not from the entitled TV population and is expecting a car in the inside lane to USE TURN SIGNALS, and they fail to do so.

Way #4
There is a third car in the inside lane. First car exits rab, and the car in the outside lane brakes to avoid a collision. The car following the outside lane exits very close the back of the car braking because they expected that car to move at the same speed. Exiting car brakes to avoid hitting the rear of that breaking car. But there is a 4th car, it's in the outside lane. Reaction time kicks in and by the time they brake to avoid the mess ahead, that 3rd car exits, crashing into them.

All cars are following all signs, all posted how-to-drive maps, all recommended "safe" advice from our keyboard experts.

BUT
If the outside lane must exit at every side road. (barriers prevent going around)
The only way to go around (pass a side road) is via the inside lane.
There would be none of this endless debates. Crashing at the rab exits would not be possible in any scenario because there would be no lane with vehicles to crash with.

Huh? I am confused. So, the developer needs to design the roadways to make certain no one crashes at an intersection? How bout those who never drove a roundabout watch a video on how to do it? Easy to do! Pick up your phone and watch!

None of those crashes would have occurred. A rule of a RAB is to yield. Yield means to let other road users GO FIRST. Easy! Allow any vehicle in front of you to GO FIRST!

[Two Bills]

Originally Posted by Randall55

When you factor in quite a few drivers do not know the area and therefore which lane to be in, some have never driven a roundabout, some are more concerned about lining themselves up with the resident gate, some are nervous and confused, some have reached the age where their reaction skills have diminished, and some have no idea what the word yield means, the RAB is too tight to maneuver. Thanks for your wise suggestions, but I am still going to stop before entering. It takes a few seconds to check your surroundings. Not a big deal.

I often drive in foreign countries, and in areas of my own where I do not know the roads as well as locals or directions etc. and mangae quite competently, but as I said in another post, if you find navigating a roundabout far to stressful and complicated, why are you still driving?
Apart from yielding to enter if needed, the lane discipline is the same as at any crossroad or T junction, so you will probably get confused, stressed etc. at them as well.
Time to give up the license.

[Randall55]

Originally Posted by Two Bills

I often drive in foreign countries, and in areas of my own where I do not know the roads as well as locals or directions etc. and mangae quite competently, but as I said in another post, if you find navigating a roundabout far to stressful and complicated, why are you still driving?
Apart from yielding to enter if needed, the lane discipline is the same as at any crossroad or T junction, so you will probably get confused, stressed etc. at them as well.
Time to give up the license.

Thanks again, But waiting a few seconds for a gap and yielding are the rules of a RAB. I have been to other countries as well and had no problems. The RAB in the Villages are NOT the same as in other countries. They are MUCH SMALLER and are designed to be driven slowly.

[Maker]

Originally Posted by Bill14564

The 3:00 car overtakes the car already in the RAB. DON'T DO THAT!

Again - not understanding the situation and making up a reply that does not follow the example... wrong three times in a row.

There is no overtaking.

The inside lane car exits directly in front of the outside lane car that is not exiting.
Inside lane car is in front of outside lane car.
Inside lane car crosses into path of outside lane car. Crash happens.

[Maker]

Originally Posted by Two Bills

I often drive in foreign countries, and in areas of my own where I do not know the roads as well as locals or directions etc. and mangae quite competently, but as I said in another post, if you find navigating a roundabout far to stressful and complicated, why are you still driving?
Apart from yielding to enter if needed, the lane discipline is the same as at any crossroad or T junction, so you will probably get confused, stressed etc. at them as well.
Time to give up the license.

you forgot the "go back north" part
smh

[Velvet]

Originally Posted by Two Bills

I often drive in foreign countries, and in areas of my own where I do not know the roads as well as locals or directions etc. and mangae quite competently, but as I said in another post, if you find navigating a roundabout far to stressful and complicated, why are you still driving?
Apart from yielding to enter if needed, the lane discipline is the same as at any crossroad or T junction, so you will probably get confused, stressed etc. at them as well.
Time to give up the license.

In TV you are driving because there is no public transportation. All other alternatives are either too expensive or cumbersome. Golf carts can’t go everywhere and some places are too far for electric carts. Although some people narrow their world and get by with golf cart paths.

[Randall55]

Originally Posted by Maker

Again - not understanding the situation and making up a reply that does not follow the example... wrong three times in a row.

There is no overtaking.

The inside lane car exits directly in front of the outside lane car that is not exiting.
Inside lane car is in front of outside lane car.
Inside lane car crosses into path of outside lane car. Crash happens.

Crash does not happen. A driver is supposed to recognize the other vehicle needs to cross over his path. You leave a gap and slow down to allow them to do it. Yield! That is the rule of a RAB.

This is not rocket science! At any intersection cars pass over the paths of other cars.

When you are at a red light, do you see those who have a green light CROSSING your path?

When you are a stop sign, do you see a vehicle CROSS OVER YOUR PATH?

That is what an intersection is!!! Vehicles CROSSING PATHS.

In a RAB, there are no stop signs or red lights. You are supposed to allow others to CROSS YOUR PATH.

[jimjamuser]

Originally Posted by Two Bills

Twelve pages of controversy?
Too many Sinatra's, wanting to do it "My Way!"

If you have a problem understanding something as simple as navigating a roundabout, you should jack your driving license in, whether over or under 60 years of age!
If you can navigate a normal crossroad, or T junction what is the problem?
The lane discipline on approach and in it, is exactly the same.
All you have to learn, and adhere too, is do not enter, but yield to any vehicles in roundabout to you left, and enter when clear to do so, and stay in that lane.
How hard is that?

I'm 84 and trying to learn Spanish this winter.
That is what you call hard!

How hard is that? Apparently, it is 13 pages hard. Incidentally, I love ALL the beautiful flowers in the center of the roundabout. Too bad that the driver's eyes are so BUSY worrying about the actions of other drivers to notice the expensive flowers.

[jimjamuser]

Originally Posted by Maker

How can they crash?

Way #1
The 3:00 car enters the rab already moving. Trivial to reach 20mph. Car did yield (was not required to stop) since they are watching traffic, see just that one other car in the inside lane, and safely enter the rab not next to that car with spacing.
The inside car exits across the path of the 3:00 car.

Way #2
Both cars traveling with a reasonable gap between them. Car on the inside lane slows down to make the exit "safer" by checking their mirrors. Then exits in front of outside lane car.

Way #3
Car in outside lane is not from the entitled TV population and is expecting a car in the inside lane to USE TURN SIGNALS, and they fail to do so.

Way #4
There is a third car in the inside lane. First car exits rab, and the car in the outside lane brakes to avoid a collision. The car following the outside lane exits very close the back of the car braking because they expected that car to move at the same speed. Exiting car brakes to avoid hitting the rear of that breaking car. But there is a 4th car, it's in the outside lane. Reaction time kicks in and by the time they brake to avoid the mess ahead, that 3rd car exits, crashing into them.

All cars are following all signs, all posted how-to-drive maps, all recommended "safe" advice from our keyboard experts.

BUT
If the outside lane must exit at every side road. (barriers prevent going around)
The only way to go around (pass a side road) is via the inside lane.
There would be none of this endless debates. Crashing at the rab exits would not be possible in any scenario because there would be no lane with vehicles to crash with.

OK, I believe you, but would it not be simpler to just have only one lane inside the roundabout? And do the merging before getting to the roundabout.......easy peasy, as they say.

[jimjamuser]

Originally Posted by Randall55

When you factor in quite a few drivers do not know the area and therefore which lane to be in, some have never driven a roundabout, some are more concerned about lining themselves up with the resident gate, some are nervous and confused, some have reached the age where their reaction skills have diminished, and some have no idea what the word yield means, the RAB is too tight to maneuver. Thanks for your wise suggestions, but I am still going to stop before entering. It takes a few seconds to check your surroundings. Not a big deal.

I agree about ALL the difficulties surrounding driving in a roundabout.

[coffeebean]

Originally Posted by Randall55

When you factor in quite a few drivers do not know the area and therefore which lane to be in, some have never driven a roundabout, some are more concerned about lining themselves up with the resident gate, some are nervous and confused, some have reached the age where their reaction skills have diminished, and some have no idea what the word yield means, the RAB is too tight to maneuver. Thanks for your wise suggestions, but I am still going to stop before entering. It takes a few seconds to check your surroundings. Not a big deal.

I don't stop before entering a RAB if I can clearly see there are no cars in site, in either lane, as I approach the RAB. Yielding works really really well in that scenario.

[jimjamuser]

Originally Posted by Velvet

In TV you are driving because there is no public transportation. All other alternatives are either too expensive or cumbersome. Golf carts can’t go everywhere and some places are too far for electric carts. Although some people narrow their world and get by with golf cart paths.

Sounds like the World's friendliest city does NOT have a friendly transportation system designed around retired people with age-normal physical limitations.

[coffeebean]

Originally Posted by Randall55

Thanks again, But waiting a few seconds for a gap and yielding are the rules of a RAB. I have been to other countries as well and had no problems. The RAB in the Villages are NOT the same as in other countries. They are MUCH SMALLER and are designed to be driven slowly.

I'm still trying to wrap my head around a "RAB within a RAB" that someone mentioned up-thread. This, of course, is not something we would see here in the US. I believe it was in a foreign country that this crazy RAB is located.

[coffeebean]

Originally Posted by Maker

Again - not understanding the situation and making up a reply that does not follow the example... wrong three times in a row.

There is no overtaking.

The inside lane car exits directly in front of the outside lane car that is not exiting.
Inside lane car is in front of outside lane car.
Inside lane car crosses into path of outside lane car. Crash happens.

This is the scenario why I "hang back" when in the RAB. I vary my speed so I am NEVER EVER beside another vehicle.

I have had one experience in all these years that scared the hell our of me. I did, however, avoid an accident because I JAMMED on my breaks and so did my carJAM on the breaks. Between the two of us, that accident was avoided. The scenario is when I was in the outside lane ready to exit at my first exit. Some person in the inside lane sped up to exit in front of me IN MY LANE. What a turkey!!!!! If I had not jammed on my breaks, there would have been a collision. The person was in the inside lane and should have STAYED in that lane to exit but NO, that person had to exit into the outside lane in front of me. I don't even think that person realized there was almost a collision. He/she went on their merry way, fat, dumb and happy!