12 killed in Paris by extreme Islamists.

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  #46  
Old 01-07-2015, 05:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Native New Yorker View Post
people in America due to gun violence than we do as a result of terrorism. Remember the movie theater in Colorado, and the Newtown massacre? Did you call for sensible gun restrictions after these tragedies?
Couple of thoughts:

1. This thread is not about 'gun control' in the U.S.

2. This is about terrorism once again coming into our homes.

3. Terrorism is meant to create widespread terror to persuade a people to submit or acquiesce to a particular group or segment, or to create an atmosphere where more and more terror will occur.

4. Did you notice the proliferation of signs "Je Suis Charlie?" It affects all of us.

5. What would you talk about if this latest tragedy was caused by a bomb? Like Boston's Marathon? The Twin Towers?
  #47  
Old 01-07-2015, 05:28 PM
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...Did you call for sensible gun restrictions after these tragedies?
Why didn't we think of that before?!? Pass some sensible gun restrictions and the terrorists will be stopped forever!!
  #48  
Old 01-07-2015, 05:32 PM
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I agree with posts here regarding PC...it may have been based upon good intentions, but it has run amok. I agree that we must be at war with terrorism. Just because there is not a "country" declaring war on us does not me that war has not been declared. It has and we need to respond accordingly.

One thing that has been mentioned a few times though that I cannot agree with is that American citizens are somehow partially responsible. We have all sorts of craziness and disagreement in our country, but we are in no way responsible for the murderous, evil acts of the terrorists.

The terrorist that have killed and plan to keep killing are the only ones responsible for such incomprehensible acts.
Polar - I hope you have not interpreted my initial post on this thread as implying that "we" are responsible for such acts. My point was that "we" let ourselves be led as sheep toward more and more political correctness without really considering the consequences.
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  #49  
Old 01-07-2015, 05:38 PM
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Polar - I hope you have not interpreted my initial post on this thread as implying that "we" are responsible for such acts. My point was that "we" let ourselves be led as sheep toward more and more political correctness without really considering the consequences.

I know you didn't mean that, dbussone. In fact yours is one of the posts that I was referring to that I largely agree with. I just get a little edgy if even a hint of direct responsibility for such atrocious acts is attributed to the U.S. in any way.
  #50  
Old 01-07-2015, 05:41 PM
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I know you didn't mean that, dbussone. In fact yours is one of the posts that I was referring to that I largely agree with. I just get a little edgy if even a hint of direct responsibility for such atrocious acts is attributed to the U.S. in any way.
Sorry. I just wanted to be sure what you were saying. No offense intended, Polar. And what do you mean "largely?" I thought I nailed it pretty well.
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  #51  
Old 01-07-2015, 06:03 PM
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If you discuss Alinsky and his followers advocates and beliefs, the thread is doomed as it is all about politics. I was even cut off discussing him and his tactics, etc when we had a political forum.
I wasn't discussing Alinsky. I had to look him up to know who he was.

Rubicon has taught me so much about debate such as the use of a "red herring" and changing the subject rather than addressing the subject. And since I am from Ohio, I know about comparing apples to oranges.

What I don't understand are those unwilling to really face the terrible danger we are in from terrorists. Maybe not here today...but the black clouds are trying to cover the sun. If we do not know WHO our enemy is, we cannot survive his attacks.

I too am continuing to wonder why the moderate and "peaceful" Muslims don't more often speak out more and disavow themselves and separate themselves from these individual acts. It would make ME feel better. They do every once in awhile...but I don't see it as wide spread.
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  #52  
Old 01-07-2015, 06:04 PM
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...And what do you mean "largely?" I thought I nailed it pretty well.

Heheh. I don't agree with anybody about everything.
  #53  
Old 01-07-2015, 06:30 PM
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I wasn't discussing Alinsky. I had to look him up to know who he was.

Rubicon has taught me so much about debate such as the use of a "red herring" and changing the subject rather than addressing the subject. And since I am from Ohio, I know about comparing apples to oranges.

What I don't understand are those unwilling to really face the terrible danger we are in from terrorists. Maybe not here today...but the black clouds are trying to cover the sun. If we do not know WHO our enemy is, we cannot survive his attacks.

I too am continuing to wonder why the moderate and "peaceful" Muslims don't more often speak out more and disavow themselves and separate themselves from these individual acts. It would make ME feel better. They do every once in awhile...but I don't see it as wide spread.
This was not a surprise. In France they have what they call NO GO zones where everything in that zone is ruled by muslims. Those not of the muslim persuasion may not enter and Muslim law prevails There are also a few of these in England and look around our country....we are creating the same kind of "zones".

The only comment I will make about Alinsky is this...one of his weapons was creating GUILT. I mentioned this in the discussion on police and the riots and it was sort of ignored. THIS IS A ALINSKY tactic as we are made to feel guilty if these kind of zones or neighborhoods are not allowed.

This is beginning in this country. Each generation has had communities, not zones where ethnicity was prevelant but never to the point of turning the back on american LAW. If you wanted to survive you HAD TO assimilate, It is not that way any longer in this country or around the world. If you do not want to assimilate you will be defended and told that is your right, and those who oppose this are made to feel guilty. That is an Alinsky tool.
  #54  
Old 01-07-2015, 06:48 PM
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This was not a surprise. In France they have what they call NO GO zones where everything in that zone is ruled by muslims. Those not of the muslim persuasion may not enter and Muslim law prevails There are also a few of these in England and look around our country....we are creating the same kind of "zones".

The only comment I will make about Alinsky is this...one of his weapons was creating GUILT. I mentioned this in the discussion on police and the riots and it was sort of ignored. THIS IS A ALINSKY tactic as we are made to feel guilty if these kind of zones or neighborhoods are not allowed.

This is beginning in this country. Each generation has had communities, not zones where ethnicity was prevelant but never to the point of turning the back on american LAW. If you wanted to survive you HAD TO assimilate, It is not that way any longer in this country or around the world. If you do not want to assimilate you will be defended and told that is your right, and those who oppose this are made to feel guilty. That is an Alinsky tool.
I concur with your comments about Zones and guilt. This will become a major issue if we do not change the political correctness push by so many who think it is the nice thing to do. All they are doing is abetting future discord
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  #55  
Old 01-07-2015, 06:55 PM
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Political correctness can and will quell freedom of speech. Political satire is the exercising of that fundamental right in a democracy. Like it or not. We only agree with the satire if it suits our ideology. To accept and succumb to the horrible outcome as "expected" in light of their political satire is outrageous. To suggest they got what they deserved is a victory for the terrorists. Certainly the two dead policemen were just there to do their job. We have to stop making excuses for their rampant murdering sprees and we need to resist blaming the victims.
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  #56  
Old 01-07-2015, 06:57 PM
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I concur with your comments about Zones and guilt. This will become a major issue if we do not change the political correctness push by so many who think it is the nice thing to do. All they are doing is abetting future discord
The push to make many feel guilty is not new. Recall the posts here on various race issues.....if you felt that anyone of color was wrong, or violated the law or whatever, you were made to feel guilty. Just recently on posts talking about police in New York, the tactic was to attack the police instead of discussing the root cause of the issue. It is the way it has been for a time now. I posted then that that guilt thing is just what is done now.

AND think how we are establishing these zones here in the USA !!!!!

I lived in downtown Tampa for a few years and can tell you without a doubt there are no white zones in Tampa. BOTH black and spanish have zones where they do not want any white folks to visit and the police restrict their visits sparingly. This, to me, is where we go wrong....we are a country of LAWS and those laws apply to EVERYONE and need to be upheld. You cannot break apart and establish your own little area. They start out as simply "unwritten" as they did in France and then become accepted....it is happening.
HOPE CARL IN TAMPA IS AROUND. I am betting he can speak to that area !
  #57  
Old 01-07-2015, 06:57 PM
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1] Is this violence or is it terrorism?
2] How do you feel about this?
3] What should be done?
4] Does this scare you?


1] I think it's violence. They must have sent death threats and warnings to stop mocking Mohammed or else. They killed the people they came to kill. It looked like a contract hit.

2] I think it is a dangerous world especially if you expect others to leave you alone when you provoke them. I wouldn't go to an Eagles/Dallas football game in Philadelphia dressed in a Cowboy jersey even though I have a right to. I wouldn't dress in Crypt colors and go into a Blood neighborhood even though I have a right to. I'm sure you can think of parallel examples.

3] I would tell newspapers satirical or otherwise that if they need protection because they are insulting terrorists then they should hire there own security and not risk the lives of policeman. I would tell employees that by working for a company like that it is risky.

4] I'm not scared at all. I have enough sense to stay out of dangerous areas or provoke a fight with someone who sees their own death as a reward to a better life.

I was in the area with my family when The Beltway terror was active. That was terror to me. The murders were random and in daylight. The area was large. The gunman did not warn anyone and was difficult to find. No one knew if there was more then 1 gunman or what the motivation was.
  #58  
Old 01-07-2015, 07:08 PM
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2] I think it is a dangerous world especially if you expect others to leave you alone when you provoke them. I wouldn't go to an Eagles/Dallas football game in Philadelphia dressed in a Cowboy jersey even though I have a right to. I wouldn't dress in Crypt colors and go into a Blood neighborhood even though I have a right to. I'm sure you can think of parallel examples.
Someone else asked this question earlier.

Would you have "provoked" Hitler? Simple question really. A world bully knocking on your door and wanting your house. Would you provoke him?
  #59  
Old 01-07-2015, 07:19 PM
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Originally Posted by tomwed View Post
1] Is this violence or is it terrorism?
2] How do you feel about this?
3] What should be done?
4] Does this scare you?

1] I think it's violence. They must have sent death threats and warnings to stop mocking Mohammed or else. They killed the people they came to kill. It looked like a contract hit.

2] I think it is a dangerous world especially if you expect others to leave you alone when you provoke them. I wouldn't go to an Eagles/Dallas football game in Philadelphia dressed in a Cowboy jersey even though I have a right to. I wouldn't dress in Crypt colors and go into a Blood neighborhood even though I have a right to. I'm sure you can think of parallel examples.

3] I would tell newspapers satirical or otherwise that if they need protection because they are insulting terrorists then they should hire there own security and not risk the lives of policeman. I would tell employees that by working for a company like that it is risky.

4] I'm not scared at all. I have enough sense to stay out of dangerous areas or provoke a fight with someone who sees their own death as a reward to a better life.

I was in the area with my family when The Beltway terror was active. That was terror to me. The murders were random and in daylight. The area was large. The gunman did not warn anyone and was difficult to find. No one knew if there was more then 1 gunman or what the motivation was.
I believe with all my heart in the right of people to say what they want. In Free speech, in the first amendment. I think it was risky, and in some ways wrong...but no one should be killed for insulting another's religion, in this day and age. You have to learn to get along. People on this forum insult religion way too frequently and I don't like it...in fact the ones who defend these terrorists are usually atheists. I am not a good example of a Christian. I don't go to church, but I hate when people deride Christians. All the Christians that I know personally are nice people and would never kill or steal or .........

Everyone should be a little more scared than they were last year. Infidels, those who are NOT Muslims are the targets of the extremists...and I believe they will come to this country...and apparently so do the people who are involved in National intelligence. I heard them talk on CNN a few minutes ago.
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  #60  
Old 01-07-2015, 07:26 PM
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Someone else asked this question earlier.

Would you have "provoked" Hitler? Simple question really. A world bully knocking on your door and wanting your house. Would you provoke him?
I have dealt with bullies in my life. They got hurt much more then I did. That's the first thing my dad taught me.

Are you asking me if Hitler knocked on my door and try to take my house what would I do? I would not give it to him.
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