[goodtimesintv]

Originally Posted by memason

The shootings in San Bernardino were horrific and my heart goes out to those folks. But even so, I refuse to live in fear of that happening to wherever I happen to be. I feel everyone has to stay aware of their surroundings, but that does not equate to fear, to me. Fear leads to bad things happening and causes us to paint with very broad brushes. Fear could also cause us to seek comfort [or security] in the wrong places or with the wrong people. In a country this size and the freedoms we enjoy, we will always have isolated incidents of violence.

I beg to differ, adamantly.

Regarding "But even so, I refuse to live in fear of that happening to wherever I happen to be."

For one thing, we are not "living in fear" of "that [San Bernardino-style massacre] happening".

National defense is not established, sustained and additionally fortified in these times because we "live in fear". It is to be ready for enemy attack and to nip it in the bud before it seizes and takes control of territory and society in our own territories.

Claiming we are "living in fear" like crazed cripples and lunatic fringe, and thus sticking our nation's head in the sand, is mockery, not civil discourse.

Secondly, it's not just an "isolated incidence" "of violence". The massacres of unarmed civilians in Paris and San Bernardino are well-planned pieces of a greater, global plan to terrorize and then seize sovereign national territory and populace for their CALIPHATE.

This article in The Atlantic, hardly a rightist lunatic-fringe publication, has it right, and this is at the core of ISIS's growing plan:

"Bin Laden viewed his terrorism as a prologue to a caliphate he did not expect to see in his lifetime. His organization was flexible, operating as a geographically diffuse network of autonomous cells. The Islamic State, by contrast, requires territory to remain legitimate, and a top-down structure to rule it. (Its bureaucracy is divided into civil and military arms, and its territory into provinces.)"


What ISIS Really Wants - The Atlantic

[Steve9930]

Originally Posted by Justus

I agree with you completely. It may be unpopular to speak the truth because some people cannot face the reality that we are targets in a worldwide hate campaign.

BTW, in case no one has noticed, the words "hate crime" haven't once been used to characterize the terrorist act of murdering 14 innocent people simply because they were "infidels". It took forever for authorities to even label it a terrorist act.

Yet the suspect who burned a mosque yesterday is already charged with a "hate crime", according to news reports. So it can only be a "hate crime" if committed against a protected class, of which muslims are the latest poster children. I suppose any other victims are just "collateral damage".

Currently I believe Trump is correct. However I would have phrased it differently. I would halt all VISAs from any of the Middle Eastern Countries who are Governed by Sharia Law and have Islamic Terrorist with in their borders. Until there is a better way to vet these people no VISAs should be granted. There is no Violation of the Constitution to deny access to the US by Non-citizens. I would also start to track down and deport anyone who has over stayed their VISA.

[MDLNB]

Originally Posted by Steve9930

Currently I believe Trump is correct. However I would have phrased it differently. I would halt all VISAs from any of the Middle Eastern Countries who are Governed by Sharia Law and have Islamic Terrorist with in their borders. Until there is a better way to vet these people no VISAs should be granted. There is no Violation of the Constitution to deny access to the US by Non-citizens. I would also start to track down and deport anyone who has over stayed their VISA.

I agree. They have declared war on us, and it should be treated as such. Not as an illness. Some times there is collateral damage to innocents when defending in wartime. Better the other side than ours. Sounds harsh, but sometimes we need to rely on hard folks to make decisions for us in extreme situations. Kind of like hiring a gunslinger to clean up a town. Of course, once that is accomplished, the gunslinger is an embarrassment and is usually ushered out of town also. What I am getting at is, try not to condemn those that call for hard or extreme measures to protect our families. These folks have to live with their hard decisions, but our families get to LIVE.

Muslim extremists do not respect weakness, and anyone that wishes to "talk or negotiate" with them is considered weak. They only respect strength and power. It does not make us like them if we have to get hard to fight them. It makes us protectors of our Freedom.

"... if the immigrant who comes here in good faith becomes an American and assimilates himself to us, he shall be treated on an exact equality with everyone else, for it is an outrage to discriminate against any such man because of creed, or birthplace, or origin. But this is predicated upon the man's becoming in very fact an American and nothing but an American ... There can be no divided allegiances here. Any man who says he is an American, but something else also, isn't an American at all. We have room for but one flag, the American flag,... we have room for but one language here, and that is the English language ... and we have room for but one sole loyalty and that is a loyalty to the American people."

Teddy Roosevelt -- 1907

[earlehancock]

I don't have any more information than you do, BUT I believe it's politically incorrect NOT to talk about it.

[Steve9930]

I was passed a link this morning from a friend that indicates the US Government is already moving Refugees into the US. They are transporting these people VIA UPS Charter Planes that have been converted to carry passengers. The planes are coming into Harrisburg, PA Airport in late night flights. Now as most of these stories go I always take them with some degree of skepticism. However they also provided a link o an interview on Bill O'Reily with Governor Christie. In that interview Governor Christie indicated the US Government is moving refugees into the country without informing state officials. They bring them in and then assign them to non-government entities such as Catholic Charities to resettle them. Christie indicated there were 75 that were moved into New Jersey and they have no idea where they are in the state. He indicated that the transfer from the US Government to these non-profit private organizations does not under law give the state of New Jersey any power to make these organizations give any location information as to where the refugees were resettled. The article went on to caution that the debate about the 10,000 is a cover while they move thousands into the country. Had I not seen the interview with Governor Christie I would have just shrugged it off but there maybe some validity to all this nonsense. I was skeptical about Government in the past but this administration has shown such a disregard for what the people want that it would not surprise me if the article was spot on.

[billethkid]

Originally Posted by earlehancock

I don't have any more information than you do, BUT I believe it's politically incorrect NOT to talk about it.

I would suggest addressing an issue as right or wrong instead of the always confusing political correctness haze?

[Bogie Shooter]

Originally Posted by Steve9930

I was passed a link this morning from a friend that indicates the US Government is already moving Refugees into the US. They are transporting these people VIA UPS Charter Planes that have been converted to carry passengers. The planes are coming into Harrisburg, PA Airport in late night flights. Now as most of these stories go I always take them with some degree of skepticism. However they also provided a link o an interview on Bill O'Reily with Governor Christie. In that interview Governor Christie indicated the US Government is moving refugees into the country without informing state officials. They bring them in and then assign them to non-government entities such as Catholic Charities to resettle them. Christie indicated there were 75 that were moved into New Jersey and they have no idea where they are in the state. He indicated that the transfer from the US Government to these non-profit private organizations does not under law give the state of New Jersey any power to make these organizations give any location information as to where the refugees were resettled. The article went on to caution that the debate about the 10,000 is a cover while they move thousands into the country. Had I not seen the interview with Governor Christie I would have just shrugged it off but there maybe some validity to all this nonsense. I was skeptical about Government in the past but this administration has shown such a disregard for what the people want that it would not surprise me if the article was spot on.

From "Truth of Fiction" web site.

Started as a email video in November 2015.




The video had more than 131,000 views 10 days after it was posted on November 9, 2015. After the terrorist attacks on Paris and public debate on admitting Syrian refugees into the U.S. that followed, the video quickly went viral. Other versions also popped up on YouTube claiming that busloads of refugees had been brought into Pennsylvania on a UPS cargo flight.

A UPS spokesperson told TruthorFiction.com that the rumor is “erroneous.”

“UPS is a cargo airline and has not been involved in passenger flights of any kind into or out of Harrisburg. Suggestions to the contrary are based on misinformation,” Susan Rosenberg, UPS public relations director, told us.

The video doesn’t provide any hard evidence or proof to contradict UPS’s claim, either. After all, it only shows is the back of a charter bus driving on a highway at night. The narrator claims that buses were parked beside a UPS cargo flight, but there’s no video (or proof) that that actually happened. The narrator also says there were “about 30” charter buses driving down the road, but only one or two buses are visible in the video. Also, the numbers don’t seem to check out: there couldn’t be enough people on one cargo flight to fill up 30 charter buses.

Also, the way that UPS uses Harrisburg International Airport in the normal course of business doesn’t jive with the video’s claims. We confirmed that UPS does in fact use Harrisburg International Airport on a regular basis — but we quickly learned that international flights rarely (if ever) fly directly into Harrisburg International Airport from outside the country.

UPS moves about 22,800 tons of cargo through the airport each year. Because there are many warehouses and manufacturers in the region, the vast majority of cargo is outbound rather than inbound. Most often, UPS flies cargo into Harrisburg from airports in Williamsport and Scranton. Then, it’s combined with cargo brought in on trucks, and UPS flights depart from Harrisburg to Worldport, the company’s main air hub, in Louisville, according to Harrisburg International Airport.

So, in the normal course of business, international UPS flights don’t fly directly into Harrisburg International Airport from outside the country. But that doesn’t mean it couldn’t happen, or hasn’t happened.

We’re classifying claims that UPS brought refugees into the country on a cargo plane as fiction. First, the company has directly denied that claim. Second, the viral video shows no proof, other than the back of a nondescript charter bus. Third, it appears that the vast majority of UPS flights fly into Harrisburg from other parts of Pennsylvania (not outside the country), and then depart for Louisville.

Another opinion.
Undercover Parcel Service : snopes.com

[Steve9930]

[QUOTE=Bogie Shooter;1158666]From "Truth of Fiction" web site.

Started as a email video in November 2015.




The video had more than 131,000 views 10 days after it was posted on November 9, 2015. After the terrorist attacks on Paris and public debate on admitting Syrian refugees into the U.S. that followed, the video quickly went viral. Other versions also popped up on YouTube claiming that busloads of refugees had been brought into Pennsylvania on a UPS cargo flight.

A UPS spokesperson told TruthorFiction.com that the rumor is �erroneous.�

�UPS is a cargo airline and has not been involved in passenger flights of any kind into or out of Harrisburg. Suggestions to the contrary are based on misinformation,� Susan Rosenberg, UPS public relations director, told us.

The video doesn�t provide any hard evidence or proof to contradict UPS�s claim, either. After all, it only shows is the back of a charter bus driving on a highway at night. The narrator claims that buses were parked beside a UPS cargo flight, but there�s no video (or proof) that that actually happened. The narrator also says there were �about 30� charter buses driving down the road, but only one or two buses are visible in the video. Also, the numbers don�t seem to check out: there couldn�t be enough people on one cargo flight to fill up 30 charter buses.

Also, the way that UPS uses Harrisburg International Airport in the normal course of business doesn�t jive with the video�s claims. We confirmed that UPS does in fact use Harrisburg International Airport on a regular basis � but we quickly learned that international flights rarely (if ever) fly directly into Harrisburg International Airport from outside the country.

UPS moves about 22,800 tons of cargo through the airport each year. Because there are many warehouses and manufacturers in the region, the vast majority of cargo is outbound rather than inbound. Most often, UPS flies cargo into Harrisburg from airports in Williamsport and Scranton. Then, it�s combined with cargo brought in on trucks, and UPS flights depart from Harrisburg to Worldport, the company�s main air hub, in Louisville, according to Harrisburg International Airport.

So, in the normal course of business, international UPS flights don�t fly directly into Harrisburg International Airport from outside the country. But that doesn�t mean it couldn�t happen, or hasn�t happened.

We�re classifying claims that UPS brought refugees into the country on a cargo plane as fiction. First, the company has directly denied that claim. Second, the viral video shows no proof, other than the back of a nondescript charter bus. Third, it appears that the vast majority of UPS flights fly into Harrisburg from other parts of Pennsylvania (not outside the country), and then depart for Louisville.

Another opinion.
Undercover Parcel Service : snopes.com[Gove

Thanks for the info. I'll have to see where the Clip of Governor Christy fits. Christie is shown with Bill O'Riely. Christies statement was that New Jersey had approximately 70 Refugees placed into New Jerey without any communications with the State. He indicated that this has become normal practice for the government to do this with resettled Refugees. They are placed with groups like Catholic Charities to handle the resettlement. One of his complaints was New Jersey had no authority to force the information of just who and where these people were placed. Need to dig deeper.

[Chi-Town]

Thanks for the lowdown Bogie Shooter.

[graciegirl]

Originally Posted by Chi-Town

Thanks for the lowdown Bogie Shooter.

Why does it matter how?


It matters to me that they are coming from Syria that has no way of providing anything much about their background except that they are Muslim or Christian.


And that a majority of Americans don't think that is a good idea AT THIS TIME.

[Steve9930]

I looked at the link provided by Bogie Shooter. Its not the one that was passed to me. I'll provide it here and those that see it can make their own decision. I'm a bit skeptical on the UPS part but the interview between Christie and O'Reily is disturbing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KIf3...ature=youtu.be

[Bogie Shooter]

Originally Posted by graciegirl

Why does it matter how?


It matters to me that they are coming from Syria that has no way of providing anything much about their background except that they are Muslim or Christian.


And that a majority of Americans don't think that is a good idea AT THIS TIME.

Why? Because its not true.
Because people make up these lies and then post on the Internet. And many gullible people believe if its printed and quoted on the Internet....it has to be true.

[graciegirl]

Originally Posted by Bogie Shooter

Why? Because its not true.
Because people make up these lies and then post on the Internet. And many gullible people believe if its printed and quoted on the Internet....it has to be true.

Are you saying that we are not getting and have not received refugees from Syria?

That was my concern. Not how they got here. I am glad for anyone to dispel rumors. That is always a good thing.

[Bogie Shooter]

Originally Posted by graciegirl

Are you saying that we are not getting and have not received refugees from Syria?

That was my concern. Not how they got here. I am glad for anyone to dispel rumors. That is always a good thing.

The facts say they were not shipped here via UPS.

[graciegirl]

The latest...thing...is being broadcast on all three major networks live at this time and that is that the LA. Schools are shut down due to a threat "against safety" of the kids. It is the second largest school system in the U.S. and judging from the press conference there is something more than a kid calling in. Watch it yourself.