[Velvet]

Originally Posted by tvbound

No one truly knows/can prove (belief/faith is not fact) what happens after the mortal body ceases - except that it slowly decomposes. THAT can be proved. Another thing that has been proved over and over throughout history however, is that the promise and belief of perpetual utopia is the single best way to try and manipulate how adherents act during their lives, both good and bad. The sad part being, that having the 'faith/belief' that there is something great waiting after we die and one only needs to convert/believe (even at the very last second), somehow justifies the abhorrent behavior so many show toward fellow human beings (particularly against those who are not the same as oneself) - while alive.

Not to say that having belief and faith is a bad thing, as it certainly isn't and should be a huge positive toward having a better living world...and how we treat others while alive.

So why hasn't/doesn't it - actually work that way?

I’ve always suspected that I agree with you. So we are “manipulated” into behaving better…lol…if it works….

Personally, I think there maybe many ways to “heaven”. I don’t think the Lord left anybody out if they are good people. The Buddhist have enlightment as sort of heaven equivalent. The Muslims have several different heavens. The Judeo Christians have the same set of guys waiting for them. Speaking personally, no way I’m not going to see if I can meet Moses and Isaiah if they have time for me. And since I fail in my good intentions so often, I will need help from Jesus to get there in the first place. Just saying….

[Blackbird45]

According to Google there are over 4,000 thousand religions in the world and even though today many religions tolerate each other's existence they all claim to be the true path to God. Which means the other religions are dead ends, this will continue to create divisions among us. I believe religion and politics should be a personal thing. They should not intermingle, and they should not be thrusted on people who do not want to conform with their views. Religious institutions should not get banket tax breaks to promote their beliefs period.

[cindyfeh]

Originally Posted by oneclickplus

Ecclesiastes 9:10 - Whatever your hand finds to do, do it with your might; for there is no work or device or knowledge or wisdom in the grave where you are going.

So, there you go. Your body is buried and your consciousness ceases completely. You do not go to heaven. You sleep and await a resurrection.

John 3:13 - No one has ascended to heaven but He who came down from heaven, that is, the Son of Man who is in heaven.

Revelation 20:4-6 And I saw thrones, and they sat on them, and judgment was committed to them. Then I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for their witness to Jesus and for the word of God, who had not worshiped the beast or his image, and had not received his mark on their foreheads or on their hands. And they lived and reigned with Christ for a thousand years. But the rest of the dead did not live again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection. Blessed and holy is he who has part in the first resurrection. Over such the second death has no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with Him a thousand years.

Anything else any church teaches is lies and deception. Read your Bible. There is a good chance that what you have been taught is not in there.

You cannot take passages out of context in the Bible. Ecclesiastes is written from the perspective of the ungodly man! Read all of Ecclesiastes.

The John passage refers to Jesus being the only to go to heaven and come back down. Son of Man is an Old Testament reference which refers to Jesus.

The Revelation passage refers to the first resurrection being for the believers waiting to go to heaven. The second resurrection is for the ungodly. If you continue reading, verses 11 - 15, this is described. The second death is for the ungodly who will be with the devil. Revelation is hard to understand because of its symbolism. John could not speak directly because he was isolated on an island, but wanted to get his message out without it being intercepted by the Romans. The Bible has overarching themes from Genesis through Revelation with many many Old Testament prophesies pointing to Christ. Please start by reading the Gospel of John and continuing through Revelation, and then the Old Testament. The Law (Old Testament) was fulfilled by Jesus in the New Testament, the Gospel.
John 3:16 - For God so loved the world that He gave his only begotten Son that whosoever believes in Him will not perish, but have eternal life.

[cindyfeh]

Originally Posted by cindyfeh

You cannot take passages out of context in the Bible. Ecclesiastes in written from the perspective of the ungodly man! Read all of Ecclesiastes.

The John passage refers to Jesus being the only to go to heaven and come back down. Son of Man is an Old Testament reference which refers to Jesus.

The Revelation passage refers to the first resurrection being for the believers waiting to go to heaven. The second resurrection is for the ungodly. If you continue reading, verses 11 - 15, this is described. The second death is for the ungodly who will be with the devil. Revelation is hard to understand because of its symbolism. John could not speak directly because he was isolated on an island, but wanted to get his message out without it being intercepted by the Romans. The Bible has overarching themes from Genesis through Revelation with many many Old Testament prophesies pointing to Christ. Please start by reading the Gospel of John and continuing through Revelation, and then the Old Testament. The Law (Old Testament) was fulfilled by Jesus in the New Testament, the Gospel.
John 3:16 - For God so loved the world, He gave his only begotten Son that whosoever believes in Him will not perish, but have eternal life.

After John, read the rest of the Gospels.

[Ptmckiou]

For me, I combine spirituality (not structured religion) and science because they support each other. Physics states energy cannot be created, or destroyed, but only change molecular structure.

Energy is all that is…all matter in the universe is made from energy. Energy has always been, and will always be. Energy can’t be destroyed. Energy can’t die. Thereby, since I am made of matter (atoms, molecules, quarks etc), then when mu body stops functioning, the energy that made me is still there. I see collectively, all that is, as….God. God being an intelligent energy. The soul, is a small aspect of God, that collective divine intelligent energy that has always been, and will always be….because “energy cannot be created or destroyed…”

To answer your question my consciousness (also energy) will continue past the demise of the vessel it’s temporarily housed in.

[PersonOfInterest]

Originally Posted by chrissy2231

Kind of like the question "What is Love?"

There are 4 'heavens' to choose from. Don't worry about choosing the wrong one, you can always submit a 'Heaven change order' and try one of the other 3. Everything you could ever want is there. You are continually immersed in conversation with God who will nurture you over eternity. There is no pain only warm, happy, pleasant feelings. You are never alone for God is always at your side. You'll have a beautiful house made of gold and the finest of things. You will want for nothing. When you get there you'll be able to discuss and debate politics all you want. Its a grand and glorious place with pickleball till you drop and parties every night. You're going to love it!

[dewilson58]

Originally Posted by oneclickplus

Read your Bible.

Yes, PLEASE do.

[Velvet]

I love this thread, so happy to hear your various views!

[djlnc]

What is love?

"Five feet of heaven in a pony tail". The Playmates, 1959

[Ginmato]

Originally Posted by Djean1981

I'm going home to the Lord.

I like to think there is an afterlife. And I do believe in evolution. But at what point did evolutionary man develop an ever lasting soul? Are Neanderthals in heaven?

[TNKYGAL]

Originally Posted by oneclickplus

Ecclesiastes 9:10 - Whatever your hand finds to do, do it with your might; for there is no work or device or knowledge or wisdom in the grave where you are going.

So, there you go. Your body is buried and your consciousness ceases completely. You do not go to heaven. You sleep and await a resurrection.

John 3:13 - No one has ascended to heaven but He who came down from heaven, that is, the Son of Man who is in heaven.

Revelation 20:4-6 And I saw thrones, and they sat on them, and judgment was committed to them. Then I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for their witness to Jesus and for the word of God, who had not worshiped the beast or his image, and had not received his mark on their foreheads or on their hands. And they lived and reigned with Christ for a thousand years. But the rest of the dead did not live again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection. Blessed and holy is he who has part in the first resurrection. Over such the second death has no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with Him a thousand years.

Anything else any church teaches is lies and deception. Read your Bible. There is a good chance that what you have been taught is not in there.

I was in my late teens having been raised in a Methodist Church, saved and baptized in a Baptist Church, and attended a few other denominations, participating in Bible studies at each. This, IMHO, is the most puzzling overlooked truth of the Bible that became clear the more I studied. When the Bible speaks of death, it speaks of sleep. Yet in my experience, when a friend or family member dies, those left behind continually say that they are now in heaven. But I find more comfort in knowing that the very next instant they DO know (if they invited Jesus into their lives) is their resurrection and then heaven. Kinda like (as one already noted) after being put to sleep - next thing you know you're back, and it only seemed like a second. So whether you are a believer or not, death yields sleep. I pray that all of you who read this thread will find the joy of Jesus in your life! There is nothing like it, and trust me, when Christians do stray (and they definitely do), their joy is diminished and getting back to Jesus is the only thing that can bring back that same joy. Nothing like it!

[jimbomaybe]

Originally Posted by Ptmckiou

For me, I combine spirituality (not structured religion) and science because they support each other. Physics states energy cannot be created, or destroyed, but only change molecular structure.

Energy is all that is…all matter in the universe is made from energy. Energy has always been, and will always be. Energy can’t be destroyed. Energy can’t die. Thereby, since I am made of matter (atoms, molecules, quarks etc), then when mu body stops functioning, the energy that made me is still there. I see collectively, all that is, as….God. God being an intelligent energy. The soul, is a small aspect of God, that collective divine intelligent energy that has always been, and will always be….because “energy cannot be created or destroyed…”

To answer your question my consciousness (also energy) will continue past the demise of the vessel it’s temporarily housed in.

So when my cell phone battery dies, or gets run over by a truck it is still operating on another plane of existence ?

[Michael G.]

Originally Posted by oneclickplus

The thing is ... no one said the 72 virgins were women.

Oh no, now I lost all hope, my everlasting life is over...........

[charlieo1126@gmail.com]

I hope wherever I go , I can get a great slice of pizza

[Michael G.]

I what they are true, and you can't take it with you, can I take a blank check along??